Bunch passing etiquette

bjay said:

Just wanted to ask peoples thoughts on etiquette when one group passes
another.

Typically faster bunches overtake to the right of slower bunches in
countries where we drive on the left. Bunches being overtaken should
be warned that this is happening by the lead riders of the overtaking
bunch.

Overtaking to the left in Australia? Bloody dangerous at best!

On Mon, 21 Mar 2005 14:10:29 +0800, bjay <[email hidden]>
wrote:

<snip>

It's regrettable that your group blocked the women's group, but I don't
think
your group should shoulder all the blame. If more time had been allowed at
the
beginning between groups, then perhaps this wouldn't have resulted. But of
course, that is with hindsight.

bjay said:

Just wanted to ask peoples thoughts on etiquette when one group passes
another.

To paint the scenario. I was in the Freeway Bike Hike in Perth on Sunday.
This was a general community event, but there was also a race included,
called the Quokka Sprint. (which had a TOTAL prize pool of $2000). The male
Sprint entrants started first, then the female sprint entrants, then the
first group of the general entrants, with a 2 minute gap between each.
I was in the first general entrants group and joined in with a fast bunch.
We caught and overtook the female Sprint competitors about 3 Kms from the
end.
We started to slow down towards the end but this allowed the female sprint
group to catch us again. They had right of way because they were racing and
we were just out for a ride. The call went up for us to move right to allow
the women through, but it took a long while for the message to get through
and be understood, meaning that the women were blocked and we stuffed up
their finish. They were understandably [censored].
We stuffed up, there is no denying that, and probably the best thing we
should have done was to just hold back and not overtake the women in the
first place to let them have a free run at the finish. A lack of experience
and overdose of testosterone stuffed that one up though!
The question I have is what normally happens when a faster bunch comes up
behind a slower group in a race situation? I would have thought that it
would be cleaner, quicker and safer for the faster group to just overtake on
the right rather than making the slower group move right, or is there a
problem with this method? What is the etiquette in this situation?
Your more experienced advice is most welcome, I want to make sure I am not a
part of a similar stuff up again!

Bjay

always pass on the right. people dont expect you on the left and may freakout and panic, the deathnell for any group.

I heard that some guys in the lead "fun" group were abusing the women, which is a bit off i think. I think that those that wanted to race should have done the quokka sprint.

Anyhow, the situation you described is a hard one as the women were probably trying to get back on your group after you passed to save themselves.

BTW, whats your real name Bjay?

Carl Brewer said:

On Mon, 21 Mar 2005 14:10:29 +0800, "bjay"

Quoted message said:

Just wanted to ask peoples thoughts on etiquette when one group passes
another.

Typically faster bunches overtake to the right of slower bunches in
countries where we drive on the left. Bunches being overtaken should
be warned that this is happening by the lead riders of the overtaking
bunch.

Overtaking to the left in Australia? Bloody dangerous at best!

If I recall, there were specific instructions for that ride that riders were to keep to the left and overtaking was to be on the right.

SteveA

"byron27" replied

Quoted message said:

always pass on the right. people dont expect you on the left and may
freakout and panic, the deathnell for any group.

Thought this was probably the case, but wanted to make sure. Thank you and
others for confirming. Don't know why they wanted to go through on the
left, there was plenty of room on the right to pass, unless those behind me
were spread over to the right? There could be more to this story that I am
unaware of, but from where I was situated in the bunch it just seemed a bit
strange that they should try and come through on the left.

Quoted message said:

I heard that some guys in the lead "fun" group were abusing the women,
which is a bit off i think. I think that those that wanted to race
should have done the quokka sprint.

I don't think this was our group, there was another bunch from the "A" group
ahead of us. Hope it was them, would hate to think we abused the women as
well!

Quoted message said:

Anyhow, the situation you described is a hard one as the women were
probably trying to get back on your group after you passed to save
themselves.

BTW, whats your real name Bjay?

Bruce, riding a 2004 Giant TCR1 composite.

SteveA said:

Carl Brewer said:

bjay said:

Just wanted to ask peoples thoughts on etiquette when one group passes
another.

Typically faster bunches overtake to the right of slower bunches in
countries where we drive on the left. Bunches being overtaken should
be warned that this is happening by the lead riders of the overtaking
bunch.

Overtaking to the left in Australia? Bloody dangerous at best!

If I recall, there were specific instructions for that ride that riders
were to keep to the left and overtaking was to be on the right.

SteveA

I was on this ride and noted that there were *no* instructions about
keeping left unless overtaking. This made it a bit of a mad-house for
nearly the whole ride. I started in the middle of the "B" group and was
overtaking people all the way until the end (picked up a few wheel
suckers to...) People where spread all over the road although it got a
bit better as I moved through to the more experienced riders nearer the
end. I didn't see or hear of any prangs on the day which, given the
number of people on the ride, is pretty amazing.

Instructions I remember in order of how often/stridently they were made
(a) Toilets at west end of pavilion
(b) Stay out of emergency lane (not entirely adhered to)
(c) Stay out of railway reserve.

D.

Quoted message said:

If I recall, there were specific instructions for that ride that riders
were to keep to the left and overtaking was to be on the right.

SteveA

I was on this ride and noted that there were *no* instructions about
keeping left unless overtaking. This made it a bit of a mad-house for
nearly the whole ride. I started in the middle of the "B" group and was
overtaking people all the way until the end (picked up a few wheel
suckers to...) People where spread all over the road although it got a
bit better as I moved through to the more experienced riders nearer the
end. I didn't see or hear of any prangs on the day which, given the
number of people on the ride, is pretty amazing.

Instructions I remember in order of how often/stridently they were made
(a) Toilets at west end of pavilion
(b) Stay out of emergency lane (not entirely adhered to)
(c) Stay out of railway reserve.

D.[/QUOTE]
I'm pretty sure* that the instructions to keep left and overtake on the right were written in big letters on the instruction sheet which came with the race numbers after registration. Along with 'no helmet, no race', 'no bib, no race' etc.

However, I did not hear any announcements to keep left either at the start or from officials during the ride. Riders in the family ride were all over the place - clearly not keeping left (or right for that matter). I was also surprised that there were so few mishaps.

*cannot swear that the instructions were as stated but only because I do not have a copy in front of me - that makes me only about 98% sure I'm right. Perhaps, only family riders got those instructions on their sheets as everyone else would be expected to know? 🙂

SteveA

bjay said:

Your more experienced advice is most welcome, I want to make sure I am not a
part of a similar stuff up again!

I've never heard of a slow group being forced to move so that a faster one
doesn't have to go around them. That's bizarre, and probably dangerous,
since it puts less capable riders closer to oncoming traffic.

--
bpo gallery at http://www4.tpgi.com.au/users/mvw1/bpo

I see it rated a good write-up in the West today 🙁((... me thinks some
politics was involved as the West was heavily involved in the other Rotary
ride earlier this summer .

"Michael Warner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

bjay said:

Your more experienced advice is most welcome, I want to make sure I am
not a
part of a similar stuff up again!

I've never heard of a slow group being forced to move so that a faster one
doesn't have to go around them. That's bizarre, and probably dangerous,
since it puts less capable riders closer to oncoming traffic.

--
bpo gallery at http://www4.tpgi.com.au/users/mvw1/bpo

"Steve" wrote

Quoted message said:

I see it rated a good write-up in the West today 🙁((...

Where abouts in the paper? Monday's paper?

Bjay

bjay said:

"Steve" wrote

Quoted message said:

I see it rated a good write-up in the West today 🙁((...

Where abouts in the paper? Monday's paper?

Bjay

wasnt that pathetic!?

I really cant stand the West at the moment. I find their sycophantic support of the liberal party and continuous bashing of gallop et al rather tiring.

As for their lack of cycling coverage, i have written to them two times previously in regards to that and they arent interested. Ben Cousins groin is a lot more interesting obviously.

"byron27" wrote

Quoted message said:

bjay said:

"Steve" wrote

Quoted message said:

I see it rated a good write-up in the West today 🙁((...

Where abouts in the paper? Monday's paper?

Bjay

wasnt that pathetic!?

I really cant stand the West at the moment. I find their sycophantic
support of the liberal party and continuous bashing of gallop et al
rather tiring.

As for their lack of cycling coverage, i have written to them two times
previously in regards to that and they arent interested. Ben Cousins
groin is a lot more interesting obviously.

Ahh, I see, sarcasm. I thought there really was a write-up in the paper.
Just went out and bought Monday's and Tuesday's paper looking for the
article. Doh!

Bjay

bjay said:

Just wanted to ask peoples thoughts on etiquette
when one group passes another.

The passing group (let's call them B grade) yells "Left" at the group being passed "D grade" from about 100 metres back. D grade responds to this call by going everywhere.

Three laps later, when B grade finally catch D grade (on D grade's bell lap) B grade swear a lot, and yell "Left, stay left" as they pass. D grade respond with "It's our bell lap".

Once the majority of B grade has passed D grade, they then sit up, their job in destroying the D grade sprint is done, so they can relax for the next half dozen laps.

Some of the D graders may slip past the B grade blockers, usually by prior arrangement with B grade friends. They go on to take the money.

Regards,

Suzy

bjay said:

"byron27" wrote

Quoted message said:

bjay said:

"Steve" wrote

Quoted message said:

I see it rated a good write-up in the West today 🙁((...

Where abouts in the paper? Monday's paper?

Bjay

wasnt that pathetic!?

I really cant stand the West at the moment. I find their sycophantic
support of the liberal party and continuous bashing of gallop et al
rather tiring.

As for their lack of cycling coverage, i have written to them two times
previously in regards to that and they arent interested. Ben Cousins
groin is a lot more interesting obviously.

Ahh, I see, sarcasm. I thought there really was a write-up in the paper.
Just went out and bought Monday's and Tuesday's paper looking for the
article. Doh!

Bjay

there was an article, though it was about 3 lines, in yesterdays rag.

byron27 said:

bjay said:

"Steve" wrote

Quoted message said:

I see it rated a good write-up in the West today 🙁((...

Where abouts in the paper? Monday's paper?

Bjay

wasnt that pathetic!?

I really cant stand the West at the moment. I find their sycophantic
support of the liberal party and continuous bashing of gallop et al
rather tiring.

As for their lack of cycling coverage, i have written to them two times
previously in regards to that and they arent interested. Ben Cousins
groin is a lot more interesting obviously.

Although there was a good article in todays West Australian.
The Western Australian government is getting rid of Rally Australia
because they spend $5.9 million to get a $9.3 million return, or $1.60
for each dollar spent. The Hopman Cup (tennis) brings in $8.50 for each
dollar spent. And the winner is!... Busselton Ironman Triathlon which
brings in a whopping $14.70 for each dollar spent.

Goodbye cars, come on bikes!

Marty