Cold vibes

I don't know why it bothers you so much.

I think most people are better off with mountain bikes, unles you use it as transportation. I like
to be outdoors and I love off-roading. I used to off-road in my Jeep, but there aren't a whole lot
of places for that anymore - at least not where I live. I got a mountain bike because I DON'T enjoy
riding along highways, breathing in the exaust, having cigarette butts and other litter thrown at
me, purposely OR accidentally. Also, what's with the leotards? (These guys on road bikes in my area
look like they got lost on Tour De France).

I post to a lot of forums and it always amazes me: People can't stand anyone who is even a bit
different from them. Their way is the only way:

On rec.photo.* it's Film vs. Digital On rec.motorcycles.* it's Harley vs. Honda On
rec.auto.makers.jeep+willys it's "19** Jeep CJ/YJ/TJ is the only REAL Jeep!"

Mike, you don't need a club or anyone's approval. Enjoy riding and do whatever you want, within
legal and moral limits. I give this post about 3 hours before a certain a**hole (Unfortunaltely
named Mike, as well) chimes in, calling us "murderers of nature".

And speaking of getting along, posting this topic is the surest way to get people flaming ;-)

Good Luck,

Igor.

"Mike" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

I have trouble understanding the negativism of non mountain-bikers towards mountain bikers. Tell
me, why the negativism? Spare me the nasty remarks. Can't we all get along?

Here's my shot at the "big answer". I am a cyclist. I think I have a mountain bike. Not a 50-pound,
dual-shock, Y-frame monstrosity that set me back $2K, but something with a strong frame and knobby
tires. And I tend to think that mountain bikers are fools. Actually, I think anyone who owns a bike
and uses it for 'recreation' alone is a fool. To me, mountain bikes just further the perception of
bikes as playthings.

However, I feel even more negative to the road racers. The spandex clad folks on tires thinner than
my pinkie finger. What the hell is the point of that?? Certainly not commuting, since a normal city
commute isn't going to give you enough distance between lights to click up to that highest gear.
Definitely not actual recreation, since you can't see or smell anything if you're whizzing along,
head down, eyes glued to the road, 'cos if you hit more than a pebble with your bike you'll ruin
your $300 tires, $500 wheels and $4000 frame.

So really, I'm cold to anyone who rides around in a bike made and marketed as a plaything to be
strapped onto your Explorer on the weekends. Maybe that explains the coldness you feel, Mike.

-automator

I'm confused... Mountain bikers are fools... Road bikers are no good either.

Yet, you are a cyclist. Which category do you fit into?

P.S. I was really looking forward to the "big answer", too.... 🙁

I'm confused. Mountain bikers are fools... Road bikers are no good either.

Yet, you are a cyclist. Which category do you fit into?

"Automator" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

"Mike" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

I have trouble understanding the negativism of non mountain-bikers towards mountain bikers. Tell
me, why the negativism? Spare me the nasty remarks. Can't we all get along?

Here's my shot at the "big answer". I am a cyclist. I think I have a mountain bike. Not a
50-pound, dual-shock, Y-frame monstrosity that set me back $2K, but something with a strong frame
and knobby tires. And I tend to think that mountain bikers are fools. Actually, I think anyone who
owns a bike and uses it for 'recreation' alone is a fool. To me, mountain bikes just further the
perception of bikes as playthings.

You're right.

Quoted message said:

However, I feel even more negative to the road racers. The spandex clad folks on tires thinner
than my pinkie finger. What the hell is the point of that??

Well, I'm dedicated to being car-free and using my bike (and occasionally the bus) for all my
transportation needs, and the truth is that a road bike, fairly skinny tires, and bike shorts make a
great deal of sense for any trip beyond a couple miles. When you're riding 10 or 30 miles mostly
just to get somewhere, efficiency counts. On the road, reasonably skinny slicks (like 23s, 25s, or
28s) are way, way more efficient than knobbies, and substantially more efficient than the fatter
touring/hybrid road tires. And being hunched over is faster than upright, although it's possible to
set up a bike with drop bars to give you access to a decent fairly upright position. And good bike
shorts (and gloves, and non-logo'd jerseys, and socks) seriously help you stay comfortable on those
long commutes, by preventing chafing down under and keeping you dry all over. My one bike is a
fairly nice (1993 trek 520 with almost all newer stuff) steel loaded touring bike (road bike meant
to take any tire width, fenders, carry weight, be about as strong as a mtn bike, be more comfortable
than a bike with racing geometry, but still a road bike). What gets me about attitudes such as yours
is that when I started with bike transportation a couple years ago, I thought the same way, kind of.
I got a mountain bike because that's the default since road bikes are so expensive and
marketed/designed for racer wannabies, and I rejected all the accessories and stuff as superfluous.
But then a couple years of trying to be serious about bike transportation later, I'm zooming along
somewhere in my roadie-esque clothes on my road bike and all the people I pass struggling to get
their mountain bike from A to B think I'm another [censored] roadie (although I do give a wave or nod
to all the oncoming cyclists that go by just for solidarity's sake). And in the future, if the
oppurtunity arises fairly cheaply, I may even try to get together a road bike that's lighter and
more aggressive than my current tank, again for efficiency's sake. Now I know I'm an extreme
minority and most roadies are indeed classist, materialist [censored] who do nothing but delegitimize
bikes as a serious means of transportation, but I feel like the steps I've taken into the world of
quasi-roadiedom have been fairly necessary in trying to be car-free forever.

I'm biking daily for commuting on a city bike, and do an occasional road ride too. I don't
have a mountain bike but have tried it once recently, have found it fun, and might very well
buy one some day.

All I can tell you is I don't feel any cold vibes against mountain bikers when I am on any of my
bikes. However I also sometimes hike, and in this role I feel *very* cold vibes when in the middle
of the quiet woods some fool on two wheels makes me think I would feel safer walking on the highway.

By the way, I don't know yet how to reconcile these hostile feelings with my possible (likely)
future as a mountain biker.

Jacques

[email hidden] (Mike) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I have my reasons for riding a mountain-bike, the main reason is I cannot afford a new, high
quality road bike. I would have one if I could! I must admit, I love the look on the face of a
road cyclist when I blow by, and it's even better when I look back while he's trying to keep up
with me.

I suspect the negative reaction is from being passed by a clunky mountain bike. I rode a mountain
bike on paved roads for a long time and got no negative reactions, because they were passing me.

I would get a road bike. You'll be even faster, so you'll really irritate people.

jacques said:

By the way, I don't know yet how to reconcile these hostile feelings with my possible (likely)
future as a mountain biker.

Don't ride too fast for your forward vision, and slow down when you see traffic in front of you. By
acting like you don't own the trails, you shouldn't have problems with hikers, unless they think
they own the trails. Mitch

"Igor" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

....Also, what's with the leotards? (These guys on road bikes in my area look like they got lost
on Tour De France).

I post to a lot of forums and it always amazes me: People can't stand anyone who is even a bit
different from them. Their way is the only way:

You mean like people wearing "leotards?" Seems like you've got your own problems regarding people
what are a bit different from yourself.

Quoted post said:

Originally posted by Nate
[B> Actually, I think anyone who

Quoted message said:

owns a bike and uses it for 'recreation' alone is a fool. To me, mountain bikes just further the
perception of bikes as playthings.

You're right.

[/B]

?? Why can't bikes be "playthings"? And why are people who use bikes for 'recreation' fools? I have a road bike and a mountain bike. I use my mountain bike for 'recreation', I use my road bike for exercise and I use them both for commuting. Bikes don't need to be used only for transportation. That's ridiculous!

heater said:

?? Why can't bikes be "playthings"? And why are people who use bikes for 'recreation' fools?

Don't take me out of context, sir. My issue is with the separation of a bike into a plaything and a
work/transportation thing. I commute every day, go grocery shopping, etc., on the same bike that I
also take leisurely cruises with. Dude, enjoy your bike as a toy, but why treat both sides of the
bike seperately?

Just look at the mountain biking guidebooks. They tell you how to drive up to a certain trailhead.
Then you take your bike off your Lexus, change into spandex, clippy shoes, logo-plastered shirt, and
cycle for 30 miles until you're back at the lexus. How about a guidebook that shows you how you
don't need to drive in order to ride, or comfortable cycle clothing that isn't plastered with logos?
I don't wear shirts with a logo for everyday wear, so I'm not going to wear a logo to bike.
-automator

Quoted message said:

You mean like people wearing "leotards?" Seems like you've got your own problems regarding people
what are a bit different from yourself.

No, Not really... I just think it looks funny, just like if you see some guy wearing a weird-looking
hat on the street and you say "Hey look at that guys' hat, it's pretty funny lookin'..." - like
that, nothing more.

"Cold vibes," huh?
Is it possible there are some real perception issues here?
DO you tend to interpret things people say in a negative sense? Are you fundamentally insecure about riding a cheaper bike?
If someone compliments your strength in riding because you ride a bike that strictly objectively speaking, requires more strength than road bikes to propel, you interpret as a slight on your bike. Please, duly consider that you might be putting those vibes through your own little refrigeration filter!
I once referred to a bke as being heavier than most of the ones the rest of us were riding, and the response was an apology for owning such a crappy bike.
Funny thing, I wasn't trying to make any value judgement, spoken or unspoken -- but one was certainly heard. Your examples sound like the same thing.
If you keep trying, you can find a way to make just about anything an insult. I mean, if somebody compliments you then they must just be patronizing you, right? Or, they may say "you're a strong rider" -- oh, but you just *know* they are *thinking* "for such a ....(negative descriptive noun of your choice)."
I flaunt my cheap thing. IT cost me about $400 new, has 15,000+ miles on it. I *know* some people look upon me with disdain -- well, if they get their minimum daily requirement of Disdain from me, so be it. I'm not riding to please them. I get far more fun for the buck than they do -- but that's also becuase I'm not making myself miserable worrying about "cool vibes."