newbie crit question

Richard said:

I've registered for my first ever race (gulp) and am hoping someone

out

Quoted message said:

there will be kind enough to post a helpful answer along with all the

smarmy

Quoted message said:

ones I expect.

Here's the question:

Approximately what is the average speed needed to finish mid-pack in

an hr.

Quoted message said:

long Cat 4-5 crit race?

I realize there are a LOT of variables involved but just an honest

ballpark

Quoted message said:

number would really be appreciated.

Since it's a short race, 30-32 mph.

Kurgan Gringioni said:

Richard said:

I've registered for my first ever race (gulp) and am hoping someone

out

Quoted message said:

there will be kind enough to post a helpful answer along with all

the

Quoted message said:

smarmy

Quoted message said:

ones I expect.

Here's the question:

Approximately what is the average speed needed to finish mid-pack

in

Quoted message said:

an hr.

Quoted message said:

long Cat 4-5 crit race?

I realize there are a LOT of variables involved but just an honest

ballpark

Quoted message said:

number would really be appreciated.

Since it's a short race, 30-32 mph.

dumbass,

he should have a training log. i drag mine 50 miles everyday.

"Richard [email hidden]>" <usethispart-> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I've registered for my first ever race (gulp) and am hoping someone out
there will be kind enough to post a helpful answer along with all the
smarmy
ones I expect.

Here's the question:

Approximately what is the average speed needed to finish mid-pack in an
hr.
long Cat 4-5 crit race?

I realize there are a LOT of variables involved but just an honest
ballpark
number would really be appreciated.

Thanks, and happy riding,
Richard

I used to do a cat 4/5 30 minute weeknight training race- granted it isn't a
"normal" crit; it's almost all either uphill or downhill- but I think we
were averaging around 23-25, for a pack finish. I'm guessing it's about the
same in an average 6-8 turn flat crit. Maybe a little more? I dunno. Help
me out here, boys. Probably ~20-22 through the corners, (at the front of
the pack) high 20's in the straights? It's not as hard as it sounds though,
if you stay in the pack.

Good luck!

suz

Richard said:

Approximately what is the average speed needed to finish mid-pack in an hr.
long Cat 4-5 crit race?

Average speed is irrelevant. You can't extrapolate your average speed in
training to what you'll do in a race. Anyway average speed varies
depending on tactics and course conditions like wind. I've seen flat
criteriums with average speeds as low as 40Km/h on up.

If you're new to racing try to concentrate on not getting dropped in the
first 5-10 laps; after that the pace frequently eases up a bit or at least
becomes more constant (at least until the last few laps).

"Richard [email hidden]>" <usethispart-> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I've registered for my first ever race (gulp) and am hoping someone out
there will be kind enough to post a helpful answer along with all the

smarmy

Quoted message said:

ones I expect.

Here's the question:

Approximately what is the average speed needed to finish mid-pack in an

hr.

Quoted message said:

long Cat 4-5 crit race?

I realize there are a LOT of variables involved but just an honest

ballpark

Quoted message said:

number would really be appreciated.

Thanks, and happy riding,
Richard

25-27 mph. But it's not the speed you need to worry about, it's the changes
in speed from attacks, turns, hills, etc. Also, the accordian effect if you
find yourself in the back half of the field going through turns.

Fomer NC30 owner

Quoted message said:

Kurgan Gringioni said:

Richard wrote:

<snip>

Quoted message said:

dumbass,

he should have a training log. i drag mine 50 miles everyday.

Try learning the English language douchebag:

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=log

Magilla

Kurgan Gringioni said:

Richard said:

I've registered for my first ever race (gulp) and am hoping someone

out

Quoted message said:

there will be kind enough to post a helpful answer along with all the

smarmy

Quoted message said:

ones I expect.

Here's the question:

Approximately what is the average speed needed to finish mid-pack in

an hr.

Quoted message said:

long Cat 4-5 crit race?

I realize there are a LOT of variables involved but just an honest

ballpark

Quoted message said:

number would really be appreciated.

Since it's a short race, 30-32 mph.

Goddamn....talk about an overestimation for a Cat. 4/5 race.

Magilla

"Carl Sundquist" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:wQ0Rd.6801$yr.1210@okepread05...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

25-27 mph. But it's not the speed you need to worry about, it's the
changes
in speed from attacks, turns, hills, etc. Also, the accordian effect if
you
find yourself in the back half of the field going through turns.

Fomer NC30 owner

Yeah, good points. Try to stay in the front third of the pack, which will
of course be easier said than done- all the experienced riders will want to
be there too because they know they won't have to work as hard as the guys
at the back.

Some other tips: Line up early- these 4/5 races sometimes have up to a
hundred guys. You do NOT want to start in the back if you can possibly
avoid it- makes it that much harder to move up. Be ready BEFORE the gun
goes off- one foot clipped in, both hands on bars, etc. Crits start very
fast. It might be a good idea to practice clipping in quickly beforehand,
but if you can't get into your other pedal right away, just keep riding
until you find a second to do it. My first crit as a cat-4 was in a
combined women's field (meaning cat. 1-4) with many of the best crit riders
in the state. Having only done a couple of road races, I had no idea how
fast these things start, and by the time I clipped in and got going,
everyone else was down the road. Dropped from the gun. I chased for 10
laps or so, until I was (thankfully!) lapped, and pulled from the race. I
was DFL, but I learned a valuable lesson.

Hold your line in the turns- you may be going through the turns 3-5 guys
deep, and won't be able to take the same lines around the turns as you would
if riding alone. Be ready for sudden accelerations- especially in the first
few laps, the last few, and any lap where there is a prime (pronounced
"preem"😉 which means a prize for the first guy to cross the finish line the
next time around.

Don't be intimidated by these speeds people are telling you about- some are
accurate, but it's much easier to go these speeds when you are racing
(especially if you're in the pack) than you could if you were just riding
around by yourself.

So treat it as a learning experience. Hang around and watch the upper
category races after your race, to get a better idea of how it's done.

And if you have a chance to do a road race first, that would be easier than
a crit for your first race, even though it's longer. You don't go
balls-to-the-wall for an entire road race like you do in a crit.

Good luck dude.
-suz
(crappy crit rider, but doesn't get dropped anymore, and once got the crowd
prime in an NRC race)

Donald Munro said:

Richard said:

Approximately what is the average speed needed to finish mid-pack in an hr.
long Cat 4-5 crit race?

Average speed is irrelevant.

I question this in beginner races. Many beginners don't know how to attack or
when or why to do so. After all, hard and well timed attacks are exactly what
blows the "average speed" concern in races with more experienced riders.
Someone sitting on the front and simply pulling the whole pack for "who knows
why" is a such a common sight in newbie (and other!) races. So there will be a
lower number of "peak speeds" (attacks) and those peaks won't be too far from
average in newbie races; in a twisted sense, average speed can actually mean
something in a newbie race. (Of course, the newbie needs to understand average
speed will become almost irrelevent as he/she moves up, as you say.) For the
OP, the deal is to figure how to be the rare newbie who knows how to bust up
that "average mentality" with appropriate attacking.

In any case, if one can't "sit in" in a newbie pack at 21 to 25 mph, then the
individual has a very basic problem. They still need to figure out how to get
out of that pack, because we can't win races without separating, even if it is
at the last moment. Of course, every newbie will win the pack sprint and should
only sit in, just ask them and watch them. LOL

Thank you every single one of you who wrote back.
I'll actually have to reconsider my preconception of the haughty experienced
racer 😉

I'll be re-reading and remembering all of this advice.

I was given several good tactical tips from an ex-crit racer, but being an
absolute beginner I wanted to get an idea of what it will feel like to go
that far/that fast. I realize the pace will be broken up quite a bit but I
won't have a very good way to simulate that even if I try on my solo
training rides.

Thanks again!

Another ex-NC owner (they're mighty nice eh Carl?)

Richard said:

Thank you every single one of you who wrote back.
I'll actually have to reconsider my preconception of the haughty experienced
racer 😉

I'll be re-reading and remembering all of this advice.

I was given several good tactical tips from an ex-crit racer, but being an
absolute beginner I wanted to get an idea of what it will feel like to go
that far/that fast. I realize the pace will be broken up quite a bit but I
won't have a very good way to simulate that even if I try on my solo
training rides.

Thanks again!

Another ex-NC owner (they're mighty nice eh Carl?)

Just remember to keep relaxed and keep in the front 3rd of the pack.
Accordian Effect will wear you out otherwise. Don't let anyone get on
the inside of you on corners...
If you can get a friend or make one before hand, make a pact to let
each other in the line and look out for each other cause people won't
give up placings unless they are real nice. Everybody wants to be up
front without working basically.