Crazy biker

"Chris Phillipo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] says...

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Last year I bought my first road bike and during the summer and fall I

put over

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1000 miles on it. I have fallen in love with cycling. But this winter

my wife

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and I sold our house and had to move in with my mom. I had my bike but

my wife

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accedently put all my gear somewhere in the storage unit we rented and

I ended

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up not able to ride this winter. We finaly got into a new house two

months ago

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and I was able to retrieve all my [censored]. I rode a couple of times but

had a very

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hard time of it. I stepped onto the scales and found that I had added

20 pounds

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over the winter eating my moms cooking! I started the atkins diet 2

weeks ago

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to loose the weight and try to get my energy back. Im really really

wanting to

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do some riding but im only allowed 20 carbs a day max. Would I be in

danger of

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bonking really fast if I went for a ride? Has anyone else tried this

diet while

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riding? BTW, I have lost 8 pounds in 2 weeks without exercise.

boy, what a thread.....wasn't it the Greeks who mentioned moderation? whatever happened to
balance? have carbs now been scapegoated to be the evil 'fattening' factor in our eating habits?

Well we have two Indian resevers here with the highest rate of diabetes in North America. If it's
not due to having refined sugars introduced to them I would like to hear some other theorys.

I suppose alcohol would count as a refined sugar?

"Just zis Guy, you know?" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

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Road rage

I prefer the term "traffic tantrum" as being more indicative of the level of maturity involved :-)

I get what you're saying, but somehow the phase "murderous tantrum" doesn't have quite the same
ring to it.

RichC

Rich Clark <[email hidden]> wrote:

: "Just zis Guy, you know?" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
: "]news:[email hidden]...

:> >Road rage
:>
:> I prefer the term "traffic tantrum" as being more indicative of the level of maturity
:> involved :-)

: I get what you're saying, but somehow the phase "murderous tantrum" doesn't have quite the same
: ring to it.

How about 'traffic idiot tantrum' or [censored] for short? It's descriptive, catchy and doesn't stereotype
by vehicle type.

--
'Philosophy, is the talk on a cereal box Religion, is the smile on a dog. Philosophy, is a
walk on the slippery rocks Religion, is a light in the fog' -Edie Brickell

Rich Clark said:

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Road rage

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I prefer the term "traffic tantrum" as being more indicative of the level of maturity
involved :-)

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I get what you're saying, but somehow the phase "murderous tantrum" doesn't have quite the same
ring to it.

Is it murderous according to the book, though? I see it more as reckless. Simply not giving a toss
who you kill.

But I take your point: it sounds less dangerous that "rage." I maintain, though, that "rage" sounds
more excusable; couldn't be held accountable, big grown-up manly-man anger and so on, instead of
just a spoilt child throwing their toys out of the pram.

It's a bit like the people who buy an SUV because in a crash they would rather the other guy died,
ignoring the fact that if they weren't driving an SUV (a) if both parties were driving vehicles
conforming to passenger car safety standards the crash quite possibly wouldn't happen in the first
place, (b) there may be no "other guy," just a single-vehicle rollover, and (c) if they were both
driving passenger cars quite likely nobody would die anyway, as passenger cars not only have less
kinetic energy (averaging over half a tonne less mass), they don't have high bumpers mounted to
rigid chassis. Cagers are not noted for following a train of thought through to its logical
conclusion.

Or maybe that's just me being paranoid because my Volvo's in the shop and I have a Very Small Car as
a loaner...

Guy
===
** WARNING ** This posting may contain traces of irony. chapmancentral.comchapmancentral.comOpen ↗ Advance
notice: ADSL service in process of transfer to a new ISP. Obviously there will be a week of downtime
between the engineer removing the BT service and the same engineer connecting the same equipment on
the same line in the same exchange and billing it to the new ISP.

"Dan Daniel" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

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(Matt J) said:

So I was riding today with a small (4 person group) when we hear a car honking behind us. I was
in front, to the left and a little behind another guy, on a 30mph one-lane-each-way road. There
were no cars ahead, a straight shot and dotted line. I come out to look back and see what the
problem is with the car - I assume he's honking at us, despite ample passing room. After glancing
back, I start to pull back behind my buddy. All of a sudden, this huge biker comes whizzing past,
damn near hits me, and shoves my back - sending me right at my friend's rear wheel. I damn near
skidded out locking up the tire to stop in time. After sprinting up to the offending biker and a
"oh, excuse me, was I in your way back there," he responds with "Well the car was honking and you
were coming out, what else can I do?" or something along those lines. My riding buddies were
dumbfounded (one of them is relatively new to biking). They couldn't believe some guy would come
up and touch - let alone PUSH - a biker into another. Had this guys simply cooled down and waited
to pass us until the driver had passed, things would have been fine. Or, he could have simply
kept passing rather than shove me aside. Or, oh my god, he could have slowed down a bit and
ducked behind us until he could more safely pass. What is up with this? Matt

Road rage and bad driving are not limited to car drivers. Considering some of the rude and stupid
moves I see bicyclists make on a regular basis, I am convinced that the percentage of idiot
bicycle riders is much higher than the percentage of idiot car drivers. It's just that you can
usually get away with such stupidity for longer on a bicycle.

And then there are the bicyclists who consider themselves above and beyond mere mortals. Like the
guy who came up behind me as I was crossing the Golden Gate Bridge. It was mid-day when the west
side for bicyclists was closed, so we were on the pedestrian side. A beautiful day, heading from
the south/SF tower toward the SF parking area. The sidewalk was full of people, tourists gawking
everywhere, not paying attention and not expecting something going 20 mph flying at them.
Obviously I am some simp who, in a situation like that, goes slow, lets pedestrians know that I am
there, etc. We are talking maybe 300 yards or less of foot traffic. But this guy comes flying up
to my back wheel , bumps me as he goes by (and I am on the road side, so if I go over I could fall
into oncoming traffic) and *then* decides to yell at me to get out of the way while he plows
through group after group of pedestrians.

Some people should stay in their living room on rollers where they can be road warrior maximus to
their heart's content.

I've also noted that behavior by some cyclists on the Golden Gate bridge. I'm from Sacramento and
first thought that all S.F. cyclists must be that way, but that bridge just seems to be a magnet for
bike riding jerks. I've had them come roaring up from behind as I was slowing or stopping for
pedestrians shouting for me and the rest of the world to get out of their way.

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[email hidden] (Matt J)

wrote in part:

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I come out to look back and see what the problem is with the car - I assume he's honking at us,
despite ample passing room. After glancing back, I start to pull back behind my buddy. All of a
sudden, this huge biker comes whizzing past, damn near hits me, and shoves my back - sending me
right at my friend's rear wheel

Did you see that "huge biker" when you glanced back *before* you abandoned your line to check for a
honking car? It sounds as if you didn't look because bicycles usually don't just appear "all of a
sudden". If you didn't look, then shame on you. If you did look, then hopefully you'll look more
closely in the future.

Regards, Bob Hunt

David Storm said:

I've also noted that behavior by some cyclists on the Golden Gate bridge. I'm from Sacramento and
first thought that all S.F. cyclists must be that way, but that bridge just seems to be a magnet
for bike riding jerks. I've had them come roaring up from behind as I was slowing or stopping for
pedestrians shouting for me and the rest of the world to get out of their way.

Yep. The first time I was ever in California was on a tour through the Northwest and down the coast
in 1979.. In the whole trip I had no bad experiences with motorists. Until I got to Marin County.
Someone spitting from a car window, a couple of cans thrown at us, people yelling obscenities. I
couldn't figure it out.... until I moved here and saw what arrogant little twerps some of the
bicyclists can be.

Weekends I dread going over the Bridge, how ever much I want to get to the Headlands, etc. Idiot
after idiot after idiot zipping around that tight curved path that leads up to the bike side. I pity
the poor pedestrians who find themselves there by mistake. And the tourists who have rented a bike
for a leisurely ride around the bay area.

Hunrobe said:

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[email hidden] (Matt J)

wrote in part:

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I come out to look back and see what the problem is with the car - I assume he's honking at us,
despite ample passing room. After glancing back, I start to pull back behind my buddy. All of a
sudden, this huge biker comes whizzing past, damn near hits me, and shoves my back - sending me
right at my friend's rear wheel

Did you see that "huge biker" when you glanced back *before* you abandoned your line to check for
a honking car? It sounds as if you didn't look because bicycles usually don't just appear "all of
a sudden". If you didn't look, then shame on you. If you did look, then hopefully you'll look more
closely in the future.

Regards, Bob Hunt

I only glanced back briefly, and in doing so must have drifted out a little. It was only a split
second that I was turned around, and he was going a bit faster than me. I didn't notice him - he
could have been beside my riding buddies or simply in my peripheral vision. Either way, I posed him
no danger and he could have easily gone around me, as I was barely off from the curb anyway. Matt

(Matt J) said:

After sprinting up to the offending biker and a "oh, excuse me, was I in your way back there," he
responds with "Well the car was honking and you were coming out, what else can I do?" or something
along those lines.

you guys should have taught this idiot a little lesson since you outnumbered him.

"Hunrobe" wrote

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Did you see that "huge biker" when you glanced back *before* you abandoned

your

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line to check for a honking car? It sounds as if you didn't look because bicycles usually don't
just appear "all of a sudden". If you didn't look,

then

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shame on you. If you did look, then hopefully you'll look more closely in

the

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future.

Regards, Bob Hunt

Funny, I've always felt that it was up to the person overtaking to make sure it was safe to do so.

Based on the origninal poster's narative, the "huge biker" seems to have been moving quite a bit
faster than the people he was passing, hence his appearance " all of a sudden".

Regardless of how carefully the original poster was riding, perhaps the "huge rider" could have
called out "on your left " to announce that he was overtaking, or maybe even waited until it was
safe to overtake?
--
mark

(Hunrobe) said:

Neither the OP nor the "huge biker" were 100% right or 100% wrong so what's so terrible about
saying just that?

no, the overtaking biker was WRONG. he should only have passed when it was safe to do so AFTER
announcing his presence.

[email hidden] (Matt J) wrote in news:ce834354.0306140901.62199455 @posting.google.com:

Quoted message said:

So I was riding today with a small (4 person group) when we hear a car honking behind us. I was in
front, to the left and a little behind another guy, on a 30mph one-lane-each-way road. There were
no cars ahead, a straight shot and dotted line. I come out to look back and see what the problem
is with the car - I assume he's honking at us, despite ample passing room. After glancing back, I
start to pull back behind my buddy. All of a sudden, this huge biker comes whizzing past, damn
near hits me, and shoves my back - sending me right at my friend's rear wheel. I damn near skidded
out locking up the tire to stop in time. After sprinting up to the offending biker and a "oh,
excuse me, was I in your way back there," he responds with "Well the car was honking and you were
coming out, what else can I do?" or something along those lines. My riding buddies were
dumbfounded (one of them is relatively new to biking). They couldn't believe some guy would come
up and touch - let alone PUSH - a biker into another. Had this guys simply cooled down and waited
to pass us until the driver had passed, things would have been fine. Or, he could have simply kept
passing rather than shove me aside. Or, oh my god, he could have slowed down a bit and ducked
behind us until he could more safely pass. What is up with this? Matt

"What else can I do." He could have eased off and waited, passing well out into the lane and away
from you three. Or, if the traffic was too heavy for that, at least a "Heads up. Passing left."
"Huge guy" had the advantage of seeing the whole situation which gave him choices. He chose wrong.

"Hunrobe" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

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BTW, along with the duty to overtake safely we all have a duty to not

change

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our lateral position on the roadway unless we can do so safely. On a bike

it's

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called "holding your line". In a motor vehicle it's called "stay in your

own

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lane".

How much, Bob? I figure I need a foot or so on each side for slight maneuvers, etc. To me, then,
"holding my line" includes such margins. If I pass a stranger without notification, it's going to be
several feet off the port side.

The large rider passing to close without notice was the idiot. If this was a race, it'd be a
different thing. If the guy passed me like that and put a hand on me, we'd be having a discussion.

--
Robin Hubert <[email hidden]

"Hunrobe" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

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[email hidden] (Dennis P. Harris)

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no, the overtaking biker was WRONG. he should only have passed when it was safe to do so AFTER
announcing his presence.

I didn't say the overtaking biker was right, just that both riders made mistakes. As for requiring
an overtaking rider to announce his presence

before

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passing on the street, that's just plain silly. Carrying that line of

reasoning

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to its logical conclusion, every car that ever passes another user of the

road

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should honk before doing so.

No, Bob, that is not a logical conclusion. The vehicle passing should've left a reasonable amount of
room between him and the passee. See my other post.

--
Robin Hubert <[email hidden]>

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Regards, Bob Hunt

Robin Hubert said:

"Hunrobe" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

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BTW, along with the duty to overtake safely we all have a duty to not

change

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our lateral position on the roadway unless we can do so safely. On a bike

it's

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called "holding your line". In a motor vehicle it's called "stay in your

own

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lane".

How much, Bob? I figure I need a foot or so on each side for slight maneuvers, etc. To me, then,
"holding my line" includes such margins. If I pass a stranger without notification, it's going to
be several feet off the port side.

The large rider passing to close without notice was the idiot. If this was a race, it'd be a
different thing. If the guy passed me like that and put a hand on me, we'd be having a discussion.

I was about to type the same thing Bob Hunt did. The way I envision this scene was that the "big
biker" was going considerably faster than the group of four the OP was in. He pulled out to pass
(possibly leaving plenty of room), when some idiot in an overtaking car laid on the horn.

Now committed to the pass (and probably beside one or two other riders), the "big rider" moves
slightly to the right to give the honking car a bit more room. About the same time, the OP starts
drifting to the left.

And here's the root of the issue to me - it's very common in most experienced packs for one rider to
announce his or her presence with a hand on the shoulder, or to arrest a bad move just like the "big
rider" did. There are no points off for physical contact - nothing sacred about our position in the
pack that isn't subject to a nudge now and then.

To me, it sounds like the "big biker" was probably a very experienced rider (noting his higher speed
and lack of hesitation for moving the OP back into line), and the OP is probaby not a very
experienced pack rider. Also, there's no reason for the "big rider" to believe the OP did NOT see
him, having just looked over his shoulder.

Of course, I wasn't there, and I'm supposing a lot - but the above scenario could certainly explain
what happened without making out the "big rider" to be a homicidal maniac. ;-)

Mark Hickey Habanero Cycles habcycles.comhabcycles.comOpen ↗ Home of the $695 ti frame

(Hunrobe) said:

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[email hidden] (Dennis P. Harris)

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no, the overtaking biker was WRONG. he should only have passed when it was safe to do so AFTER
announcing his presence.

I didn't say the overtaking biker was right, just that both riders made mistakes. As for requiring
an overtaking rider to announce his presence before passing on the street, that's just plain
silly. Carrying that line of reasoning to its logical conclusion, every car that ever passes
another user of the road should honk before doing so.

Silly or not, it's required by law in Ohio: "The operator of a vehicle or trackless trolley
overtaking another vehicle or trackless trolley proceeding in the same direction shall, except as
provided in division (C) [i.e. on divided highways and roads of 4 or more lanes] of this section,
signal to the vehicle or trackless trolley to be overtaken, shall pass to the left thereof at a safe
distance, and shall not again drive to the right side of the roadway until safely clear of the
overtaken vehicle or trackless trolley." (Ohio revised code, 4511.27(A))

It doesn't say what constitutes a "signal", but a later section implies that it's an *audible*
signal. Fortunately, no drivers pay attention to this section.

--
Ray Heindl (remove the X to reply)

Mark Hickey wrote <snip>

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And here's the root of the issue to me - it's very common in most experienced packs for one rider
to announce his or her presence with a hand on the shoulder, or to arrest a bad move just like the
"big rider" did. There are no points off for physical contact - nothing sacred about our position
in the pack that isn't subject to a nudge now and then.

I have ridden in packs a bit - not a whole lot but enough to be comfortable at close quarters. Had
he simply laid a hand on my shoulder or something, I would have been a little startled, but not
overly [censored]. However, this was an all out shove in the small of my back, sent me a couple mph
faster and to the right, into my friend's rear wheel. Fortunately, I was in the hoods and could grab
the brakes in time (the rear wheel skidded and almost fishtailed). If anyone did that in a paceline
it would be a disaster.

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To me, it sounds like the "big biker" was probably a very experienced rider (noting his higher
speed and lack of hesitation for moving the OP back into line), and the OP is probaby not a very
experienced pack rider. Also, there's no reason for the "big rider" to believe the OP did NOT see
him, having just looked over his shoulder.

I don't know why I didn't see him - I suppose because I glanced back only briefly and saw the car
out of the peripheral vision, the bikes were farther to the right on the road.

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Of course, I wasn't there, and I'm supposing a lot - but the above scenario could certainly
explain what happened without making out the "big rider" to be a homicidal maniac. ;-)

Don't know I'd call him a homicidal maniac, but an [censored] certainly. As I said before the
(seasoned) riders I was with all thought it was outrageous. Matt

Mark Hickey said:

The way I envision this scene was that the "big biker" was going considerably faster than the
group of four the OP was in. He pulled out to pass (possibly leaving plenty of room), when some
idiot in an overtaking car laid on the horn.

I don't buy it. If the "big biker" was so experienced, he should have checked for overtaking traffic
before passing.

Art Harris

Harris said:

Mark Hickey said:

The way I envision this scene was that the "big biker" was going considerably faster than the
group of four the OP was in. He pulled out to pass (possibly leaving plenty of room), when some
idiot in an overtaking car laid on the horn.

I don't buy it. If the "big biker" was so experienced, he should have checked for overtaking
traffic before passing.

We don't know that the overtaking car was really an issue, or if the driver was just laying on the
horn out of general indignation (from way back). Even so, going two wide with cars passing isn't
always that big a deal - most every group ride ends up having to do that many times in the normal
course of the ride.

Mark Hickey Habanero Cycles habcycles.comhabcycles.comOpen ↗ Home of the $695 ti frame