Training Problems

Being that your condition is improving, but your bodyweight is not decreasing according to the scales there is a possibility that your lean mass is increasing and your bodyfat is decreasing, but that would typically only happen if your diet was improved or "cleaned out".

The supplements that you are using gives me some insight about you. Those are the perfect combination of supplements to gain lean muscle mass or to retain muscle mass in a cardio or training situation.

I personally would keep those supplements in your diet, but if you have the genetic ability to put on lean mass you may have trouble getting down to that bodyweight.

I know I didn't totally address your question, but I thought I would throw in the slight possibility that your lean mass may be increasing.

Felt_Rider said:

Being that your condition is improving, but your bodyweight is not decreasing according to the scales there is a possibility that your lean mass is increasing and your bodyfat is decreasing, but that would typically only happen if your diet was improved or "cleaned out".

The supplements that you are using gives me some insight about you. Those are the perfect combination of supplements to gain lean muscle mass or to retain muscle mass in a cardio or training situation.

I personally would keep those supplements in your diet, but if you have the genetic ability to put on lean mass you may have trouble getting down to that bodyweight.

I know I didn't totally address your question, but I thought I would throw in the slight possibility that your lean mass may be increasing.

I think it is near impossible for anyone to gain muscle mass from cycling. Cycling breaks down muscles, especially long hard rides.

[quote="drean"]I started training (MTB-ing) seriously again about 3 months ago, dropped from 96 to 86 kilos and got my resting heartrate from 86 to 52. The first two months I did moderate one hour intervals 3 times a week (to drop my weight), the other 3 days were spent on moderate intensity 90 minute sessions (all of this on my trainer)
I havent been able to shed any weight for the last month (around the waist ) but my fitness levels and recovery rate is improving all the time (my legs are also developing fast). I have 65 days left before the South African season starts with a horribly tough race (Barberton Classic). I am supplementing on L-Glutamine (2-3mg per day), Whey Protein and Creatine (2mg per day)

I've got two problems:
1. I need to lose another 8 kilos (I'm 30 years old and 1,84m tall)
2. On rides (road, off-road and on the trainer) I suffer terribly for the first hour - then it's a piece of cake - how do I remedy this?

Everyone's got an opinion, eg. too much slow twitch & too little fast twitch, strength, supplementation, diet, etc, etc, etc. . . .

Has anyone got an idea what to do - especially about the 2nd problem.

Blessings
Drean du Preez[B][/QUOTE]A few things:
Ditch the creatine - it's of no use to endurance performance and is only helping you retain water within your muscles. Taking the creatine out of your diet (and I assume you meant 2g/day, not 2mg) will cause you to immediatley drop some weight as your body rids itself of the extra water, and this may help w/problem #2 as well. Excess water within the muscles increases the distance that oxygen must travel between the capillaries and the sites of aerobic respiration. It's possible that after you sweat some of the fluids out, you begin to ride "better" due to a more efficient O2 kinetics.
Supplementing with any kind of protein powder is rarely necessary for enduranc athletes. You need between ~1.2-1.4 g of protein/kg of body weight, so about 105-115g of protein/day. This is easily achievable with a normal diet that is rich in complex carbs and lean protein sources. Powders can be convenient however, so I don't discourage them, but they are not necessary per se.
Lastly, if you want to loose some extra weight, limit your caloric intake during the times of the day that are furthest away from your training. Eat well before, during and immediately after training, and then cut back just a little bit the rest of the time. Discountinue this at anytime you feel you are not recovering properly.

Felt_Rider said:

Being that your condition is improving, but your bodyweight is not decreasing according to the scales there is a possibility that your lean mass is increasing and your bodyfat is decreasing, but that would typically only happen if your diet was improved or "cleaned out".

The supplements that you are using gives me some insight about you. Those are the perfect combination of supplements to gain lean muscle mass or to retain muscle mass in a cardio or training situation.

I personally would keep those supplements in your diet, but if you have the genetic ability to put on lean mass you may have trouble getting down to that bodyweight.

I know I didn't totally address your question, but I thought I would throw in the slight possibility that your lean mass may be increasing.

Neither diet nor aerobic exercise will induce significant increases in lean body mass. This can only be accomplished by strength training w/o restrictions to caloric intake. In some (typically mesomorphic types), muscle mass can be maintained (e.g.: cyclists with large legs and modest arms), but normally, high volume endurance training will have a catabolic effect (e.g.: elite marathoners' and road cyclists' upper bodies).

velomanct said:

I think it is near impossible for anyone to gain muscle mass from cycling. Cycling breaks down muscles, especially long hard rides.

🙂 That's why I used the words "slight possibility"

There is always that one person that has the genetics that defy all rules. That and good nutrition and they seem to gain lean mass doing just about anything. I am around more of those types than most people since my field of expertise is in bodybuilding.

Smartt/RST said:

Neither diet nor aerobic exercise will induce significant increases in lean body mass. This can only be accomplished by strength training w/o restrictions to caloric intake. In some (typically mesomorphic types), muscle mass can be maintained (e.g.: cyclists with large legs and modest arms), but normally, high volume endurance training will have a catabolic effect (e.g.: elite marathoners' and road cyclists' upper bodies).

I am aware of marathon runners, endurance training and catabolic effects, but in the original post he did not mention long endurance training did he?

If you read his post again I would not say that he is doing enough cycling to create a catabolic effect. Add in the additional amount of protein, creatine and glutamine with the right genetics he may not lose mass. Since this individual only gave us a glimpse into to his diet and training none of us can really speculate to why he is not losing according to the scales.

Smartt/RST said:

A few things:
Ditch the creatine - it's of no use to endurance performance and is only helping you retain water within your muscles. Taking the creatine out of your diet (and I assume you meant 2g/day, not 2mg) will cause you to immediatley drop some weight as your body rids itself of the extra water, and this may help w/problem #2 as well. Excess water within the muscles increases the distance that oxygen must travel between the capillaries and the sites of aerobic respiration. It's possible that after you sweat some of the fluids out, you begin to ride "better" due to a more efficient O2 kinetics.
Supplementing with any kind of protein powder is rarely necessary for enduranc athletes. You need between ~1.2-1.4 g of protein/kg of body weight, so about 105-115g of protein/day. This is easily achievable with a normal diet that is rich in complex carbs and lean protein sources. Powders can be convenient however, so I don't discourage them, but they are not necessary per se.
Lastly, if you want to loose some extra weight, limit your caloric intake during the times of the day that are furthest away from your training. Eat well before, during and immediately after training, and then cut back just a little bit the rest of the time. Discountinue this at anytime you feel you are not recovering properly.

Thanks to all that replied. Didn’t know the whole thing about Creatine and water – makes sense how some guys seem to have such great results in muscle growth on this stuff.

I am on a fairly strict diet (fat & sugar-wise) but the clincher may be after dinner when the kids’ snacks challenges me to see who’s the last man standing.

I’ve got another question for Michael: My cardio seems to be improving inmensly, but I am lacking in the power department. As I mentioned in my previous post – our season starts out with two really scary rides. The first one is basically 70% uphill (1800m climb in 75km’s) I do not have time to go to a gym, I have some basic equipment at home (leg extensions, hamstring curls & free weights).
Will it work to set my trainer on maximum resistance, slow gear, and “mash” for 1 or 2 one-hour sessions a week at app. 65-70 cadence?

I must add that I have Lateral Band Syndrome in one of my knees (10 years of BMX-ing) but it only poses a problem when I haven’t been cycling for about three months. Sometimes in tough uphills it starts to ache a bit, but not enough to actually stop me from riding. I bought myself Specialized Body Geometry Shoes and it feels great (No more knock-kneeing against the top tube.)

Again, thanks for taking the time to help us “nobodies”

Smartt/RST said:

A few things:
Ditch the creatine - it's of no use to endurance performance and is only helping you retain water within your muscles. Taking the creatine out of your diet (and I assume you meant 2g/day, not 2mg) will cause you to immediatley drop some weight as your body rids itself of the extra water, and this may help w/problem #2 as well. -- snip --

Micheal, What do you make of this study?

ncbi.nlm.nih.govquery.fcgiOpen ↗

I know it's not dealing with cyclists, but it does deal with the endurance benefit of Creatine related to lactate threshold. I can't say for certain my supplementation with Creatine has lead to an increase in weight (one year of use, liquid version from MMUSA, www.creatine.com).

I really would like to see some more studies that will show the effectiveness (or lack there of) when dealing with elite/pro cyclists and Creatine.