Fitting a threadless headset??

Your bike shop will have one. They should have offered to fit it when
you went round there.

The press is necessary if you want to make sure the mounts are fully
seated and nothing is damaged.

You can use a mallet and a block of wood if you fancy taking your
chances. It's easy to get the mounts in squint and then they jam.

Don't suppose you are in the Nottingham/Derby area? If so, give me a
shout and I'll bring mine round.

Ian

Zardoz said:

Got my new frame and forks and just had the headset through the
post...

Now I've started fitting it all and its all interference fit (I took
it down the LBS to make sure it was all the right size and they said
so) but I've just noticed the instructions talk about fitting the top
and bottom cups with a headset press.

Where do I get one of these and how much difference is it going to
make? I've been merrily banging the cups in with my rubber mallet and
I'd be horrified to find that they were out of square or that I'd
damaged a surface.

Yes it is possible to damage the headset or even the frame through bodging
so be careful. Mallet & block of wood or a home-made press can be used
but the hassle and risk is not worth it, IMO.

If bike shops are useful for anything, it's for fitting headsets. That'll
save you shelling out £36 for a Cyclus head cup press*--a tool so good it
makes the job reliable, easy and pleasant but only worth buying if you
intend to fit more than one headset. Crown race fitting tool is another
£26, though the crown race is easier/safer to bodge without a proper tool,
if you're lucky.

Quoted message said:

Once these things are on they're not coming off.

That'll save you buying the remover tools at another £48 ;-)

* from Parker International. Google to check if anywhere else has it for
less.

~PB

Pete Biggs [email hidden] opined the following...

Quoted message said:

* from Parker International. Google to check if anywhere else has it for
less.

Worth asking Ceeway (www.framebuilding.com) as they supply Cyclus (And
others) to trade. I do know that the Cyclus headset facer and reamer is
_significantly_ cheaper than the Park equivalent.

Jon

Zardoz said:

Got my new frame and forks and just had the headset through the
post...

Now I've started fitting it all and its all interference fit (I took
it down the LBS to make sure it was all the right size and they said
so) but I've just noticed the instructions talk about fitting the top
and bottom cups with a headset press.

Where do I get one of these and how much difference is it going to
make? I've been merrily banging the cups in with my rubber mallet and
I'd be horrified to find that they were out of square or that I'd
damaged a surface. Once these things are on they're not coming off.

Go to a bike shop. The mallet technique should be reserved for cheap
nasty bikes and all-steel headsets.

In article <41572566.0@entanet>, Zog The Undeniable

Quoted message said:

Go to a bike shop. The mallet technique should be reserved for
cheap nasty bikes and all-steel headsets.

Bring all of the bits which you have bought and I will happily(sp)
fit them for a very moderate fee - well nearly.

Buy all of the bits from me and they will be fitted free.

Other shops may charge differently but the ideal will be the same -
IMVHO.

--
A T (Sandy) Morton
on the Bicycle Island
In the Global Village
http://www.millport.net

Quoted message said:

Bring all of the bits which you have bought and I will happily(sp)
fit them for a very moderate fee - well nearly.

Ah, but Millport is such a very, very long way from Chepstow....

Thanks for the offer :-)

Si

Zardoz <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Got my new frame and forks and just had the headset through the
post...

Now I've started fitting it all and its all interference fit (I took
it down the LBS to make sure it was all the right size and they said
so) but I've just noticed the instructions talk about fitting the top
and bottom cups with a headset press.

Where do I get one of these and how much difference is it going to
make? I've been merrily banging the cups in with my rubber mallet and
I'd be horrified to find that they were out of square or that I'd
damaged a surface. Once these things are on they're not coming off.

Aha - I see someone else is posting questions about threadless headset
fitting. I'm also unsure about this, but my problem is slightly
different; I've just bought a 2nd-hand frame with the headset cups and
crown race already fitted (Cane Creek headset/Sintema Muddy 1" forks),
but am not 100% sure about the next steps, as I've never had a bike
with an Aheadset before. Is getting the right amount of play in the
headset (smooth, not too loose, not too tight) without it gradually
working loose as simple as fitting stem and spacers and then
tightening the top cap to suit (to 'close up' the assembly without the
bearings binding), or is there more to it than this? Also, for the top
cap, the 'expanding plug' types sold for carbon fork steerers seem to
be a better design than the earlier 'star' types; are the former also
OK for steel steerers?

Thanks in advance for any fitting info/top cap recommendations,
David E. Belcher

David E. Belcher wrote

Quoted message said:

Is getting the right amount of play in the
headset (smooth, not too loose, not too tight) without it gradually
working loose as simple as fitting stem and spacers and then
tightening the top cap to suit (to 'close up' the assembly without the
bearings binding), or is there more to it than this?

You've pretty much got it.

Make sure the top of the top spacer is about 2-3mm above the top of the
fork steerer.
With the stem bolts loose, tighten the cap bolt slowly to the point
where there is still some play when you wiggle the fork. Tighten the
stem bolts and check again that there is some play when you wiggle the
handlebars up and down.
What you then do is a gradual repetitive process as follows:
1)Loosen stem bolts
2)Tighten cap bolt 1/6 turn (easy to see 1/6 turn because it is a hex
bolt i.e. six sides)
3)Tighten stem bolts
4)Wiggle h/bars up and down to check for play
Repeat these four steps until play has gone. When play has gone, STOP.
Ian

David E. Belcher said:

Aha - I see someone else is posting questions about threadless headset
fitting. I'm also unsure about this, but my problem is slightly
different; I've just bought a 2nd-hand frame with the headset cups and
crown race already fitted (Cane Creek headset/Sintema Muddy 1" forks),
but am not 100% sure about the next steps, as I've never had a bike
with an Aheadset before. Is getting the right amount of play in the
headset (smooth, not too loose, not too tight) without it gradually
working loose as simple as fitting stem and spacers and then
tightening the top cap to suit (to 'close up' the assembly without the
bearings binding),

Yes, same as threaded headsets except preload on the bearings is obtained
by the stem simply pressing down on the bearings (via any spacers) instead
of the job being done by a threaded race.

Loosen steerer clamp bolts on side of stem, tighten top bolt by a small
amount, tighten steerer bolts, test for play by rocking bike back and
forth with front brake on (if non suspension fork), repeat as necessary.

This page is good for more info:
URL:www.parktool.com/repair_help/howfix_headthreadless.shtml

Quoted message said:

or is there more to it than this? Also, for the top
cap, the 'expanding plug' types sold for carbon fork steerers seem to
be a better design than the earlier 'star' types; are the former also
OK for steel steerers?

Yes, and alloy, as long as the steerer internal diameter is appropriate.
They do weigh a little more than a star nut arrangement, though, and some
don't work as well, apparently. (My Woodman one works fine as long as
there is a spacer underneath it).

~PB

Zog The Undeniable said:

Zardoz said:

Got my new frame and forks and just had the headset through the
post...

Now I've started fitting it all and its all interference fit (I took
it down the LBS to make sure it was all the right size and they said
so) but I've just noticed the instructions talk about fitting the top
and bottom cups with a headset press.

Where do I get one of these and how much difference is it going to
make? I've been merrily banging the cups in with my rubber mallet and
I'd be horrified to find that they were out of square or that I'd
damaged a surface. Once these things are on they're not coming off.

Go to a bike shop. The mallet technique should be reserved for cheap
nasty bikes and all-steel headsets.

I repainted my Flevo Oke Ja and fitted a new headset to it. Long
story - the headset needed is no longer made, but some kind soul on
here had one surplus to requirements, so I bought an agreeable
substitute from Future Cycles, posted it off and received the one I
wanted.

I then took the head set and the relevant part of the Flevo to Darth
Ian at Future. I'd said how I didn't want to resort to mallets and
blocks of wood and getting a proper job done with proper tools would
be a Good Thing. He agreed, and used his three pronged springy thing
to remove the old races. However when it came to using his headset
press (screw together kind) he was stumped as the extreme length of
the headtube (over a foot) meant his press couldn't reach. So he used
a mallet and block of wood.

Tim
--
Blue Witch laughed at me

Tim Hall [email hidden] opined the following...

Quoted message said:

Zog The Undeniable said:

Zardoz said:

Got my new frame and forks and just had the headset through the
post...

Now I've started fitting it all and its all interference fit (I took
it down the LBS to make sure it was all the right size and they said
so) but I've just noticed the instructions talk about fitting the top
and bottom cups with a headset press.

Where do I get one of these and how much difference is it going to
make? I've been merrily banging the cups in with my rubber mallet and
I'd be horrified to find that they were out of square or that I'd
damaged a surface. Once these things are on they're not coming off.

Go to a bike shop. The mallet technique should be reserved for cheap
nasty bikes and all-steel headsets.

I repainted my Flevo Oke Ja and fitted a new headset to it. Long
story - the headset needed is no longer made, but some kind soul on
here had one surplus to requirements, so I bought an agreeable
substitute from Future Cycles, posted it off and received the one I
wanted.

I then took the head set and the relevant part of the Flevo to Darth
Ian at Future. I'd said how I didn't want to resort to mallets and
blocks of wood and getting a proper job done with proper tools would
be a Good Thing. He agreed, and used his three pronged springy thing
to remove the old races. However when it came to using his headset
press (screw together kind) he was stumped as the extreme length of
the headtube (over a foot) meant his press couldn't reach. So he used
a mallet and block of wood.

I've now fitted the same headset twice using the "Use a bigger hammer
{TM}" technique! My recumbent has many quirks (Currently it has no seat
as I'm rebuilding the mounting points!) but the headset has not been
problematic.

If you can get your LBS to fit it and are prepared to pay them to do so,
fine. But as long as you are careful about it a mallet and a block of
wood will do the same job, if a little less elegantly.

If you're really bothered, buy a length of threaded rod, some reasonably
thick steel and some nuts (to fit the rod). If you can't work out how to
make a headset press from these (With a spanner or two) I would suggest
approaching your LBS. ;-)

Jon

in message <[email hidden]>, Zardoz

(') said:

Got my new frame and forks and just had the headset through the
post...

Now I've started fitting it all and its all interference fit (I took
it down the LBS to make sure it was all the right size and they said
so) but I've just noticed the instructions talk about fitting the top
and bottom cups with a headset press.

Absolutely.

Quoted message said:

Where do I get one of these and how much difference is it going to
make? I've been merrily banging the cups in with my rubber mallet and
I'd be horrified to find that they were out of square or that I'd
damaged a surface. Once these things are on they're not coming off.

Go to your LBS. Go direct to your LBS. Use bribery, use pleading, use
whatever you like, but get them to do it. This is not a job to try
without the proper tools.

Alternatively, go out and buy a headset press of the right size, which
will clutter up your toolbox for the next thirty years and never get
used again.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

Morning had broken, and I found when I looked that we had run out
of copper roove nails.

Many thanks to Ian & Pete for stuff about Aheadset adjustment - I've
printed it off for reference and hope to have a crack at the actual
task in the not too distant future. I haven't seen the actual frame
yet, as it's been delivered to my parents' house, though Dad assures
me over the phone that it's very good indeed, comprising this frame
(less original Cr-Mo forks);

http://www.sw-cykler.dk/udstilling/fortframe/cross%20foco.htm

with these Sintema forks;

http://www.bellatisport.com/Sintema/muddy1.jpg

Nice!

David E. Belcher