electric bike

nick said:

Anyone here own up to riding one? Am thinking of getting one to extend the
range of my occasional bike trips, as my better half seems to be developing
ever more stamina, whilst I seem to get less :-( At 50+ and with a
dodgy knee I am less keen to "work" at it, but can see the attraction of a
the odd bit of discrete power assistance :-) Have worked out that the
Powabyke is a bit of a dinosaur whilst the Giant Lafree is one of the better
ones, but would welcome any views, comments, warnings, as I am new to all
this....

Here are some links, if you are interested...

http://www.powabyke.com/index.html

http://www.50cycles.com/index.html

http://www.comptoncycles.co.uk/products.php?plid=m1b24s129p353&tbv=GIANT_GIANT_Lafree_Twist_Electric_BIKES_Electric_Bikes

We've had an electric bike in the family for a few years, so I'm
qualified to comment on this one.

Unless your current trips are very short, you're not likely to
increase your cycling distance by much. My wife used hers for trips of
about 20 miles (ie 10 each way) but I suspect that was pushing the
limits of the battery capacity.

Also, if you're already cycling then you won't benefit from the
"psychological assist" that an electric motor gives. I think the
machines are great for getting non-cyclists out on bikes but, ime, the
evolution to an unassisted bike is then fairly rapid.

OTOH, as long as you approach them without too high expectations,
e-assist bikes are great. They are an environmentally friendly mode of
transport and one that gives you as much exercise as you choose.

However, I'd recommend that the best way for someone in your position
to 'extend range' would be to turn your occasional trips into regular
trips. Trust me, you'll soon put on the necessary muscle (it's also
noticable how rapidly it all drops off when you stop regular cycling).

Unless the knee is totally US then a good choice of low gears should
address that problem.

If you do go the e-bike route then I'd look at Heinzmann equipped
bikes. The system is retrofitted to bikes but, assuming a half-decent
base machine, you'll end up with a bike that is far superior in terms
of power:weight ratio and overall build quality than the Powabykes.

nick said:

Anyone here own up to riding one? Am thinking of getting one to extend the
range of my occasional bike trips, as my better half seems to be developing
ever more stamina, whilst I seem to get less :-( At 50+ and with a
dodgy knee I am less keen to "work" at it, but can see the attraction of a
the odd bit of discrete power assistance :-) Have worked out that the
Powabyke is a bit of a dinosaur whilst the Giant Lafree is one of the better
ones, but would welcome any views, comments, warnings, as I am new to all
this....

Have a look at the AtoB site. They have a buyers guide to electric
bikes on their website and the magazine (well worth subscribing to)
regularly reviews them.

http://www.atob.org.uk/

Tony

"Tony Raven" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

nick wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Anyone here own up to riding one? <snip>

Have a look at the AtoB site. They have a buyers guide to electric bikes
on their website and the magazine (well worth subscribing to) regularly
reviews them.

http://www.atob.org.uk/

Tony

Thanks for the link Tony - I did see that site a few days ago - looks very
good.
Just wondered if anyone here had any real life experience/views on electric
bikes...

Cheers anyway, Nick

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in message <[email hidden]>, nick

(') said:

Anyone here own up to riding one? Am thinking of getting one to
extend the range of my occasional bike trips, as my better half seems
to be developing
ever more stamina, whilst I seem to get less :-( At 50+ and with
a dodgy knee I am less keen to "work" at it, but can see the
attraction of a
the odd bit of discrete power assistance :-) Have worked out that
the Powabyke is a bit of a dinosaur whilst the Giant Lafree is one of
the better ones, but would welcome any views, comments, warnings, as I
am new to all this....

Well, I'm not going to be popular.

There are two problems with your suggestion.

First if you _were_ right in your suggestion that an electric bike would
result in you doing less work, you would be doing yourself no favours.
As we go towards old age (and I'm pretty much of an age with you) it is
very important in my opinion to keep the joints moving smoothly and the
lungs and heart well exercised. Yes, modern science can keep people
alive to ridiculous ages as helpless cripples, being bullied by 'care
assistants' to stagger with a zimmer frame from the seat in front of
the telly to the commode and back again, but do you really want to
become that person? I don't. So for the good of your health you
shouldn't be seeking to get less exercise, *particularly* at our age.

But secondly, and fortunately, you're not going to get less exercise.
You're going to get more. Because your electric bike has a heavy
battery with limited energy density. So for the first few miles of your
ride your better half is going to be pedalling along gently and
comfortably on her light, comfortable pedal cycle, and you're going to
be whirring along gently and comfortably beside her. And for the other
three quarters of your ride she's going to pedalling along gently and
comfortably on her light, comfortable pedal cycle, and you're going to
be pechting and panting along behind her, lugging the weight of that
useless battery and motor up every hill.

The lazy man does more work.

Of course, after trying this a couple of times the horrible contraption
will go into the back of the garden shed, where it will gradually
moulder and rust because 'cycling is too hard'. Cycling isn't too hard.
Cycling on a good bike isn't at all hard. And frankly for the price of
one of these abhominations you could get a very good bike which would
be a joy to use and keep you fit an mobile for another thirty or forty
years.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; may contain traces of nuts, bolts or washers.

nick said:

"Tony Raven" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

nick wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Anyone here own up to riding one? <snip>

Have a look at the AtoB site. They have a buyers guide to electric bikes
on their website and the magazine (well worth subscribing to) regularly
reviews them.

http://www.atob.org.uk/

Tony

Thanks for the link Tony - I did see that site a few days ago - looks very
good.
Just wondered if anyone here had any real life experience/views on electric
bikes...

The reason for pointing you there is AtoB have tested most of the bikes.
Its an enthusiasts magazine so their tests are pretty good - much
better than normal magazine fare. I'd be inclined to get the
backnumbers that have tests of bikes you are interested in. I don't
think you'll get a better appraisal anywhere else.

TOny

Quoted message said:

And for the other
three quarters of your ride she's going to pedalling along gently and
comfortably on her light, comfortable pedal cycle, and you're going to
be pechting and panting along behind her, lugging the weight of that
useless battery and motor up every hill.

Friday I was in the car (gasp! Makes sign of cross, waves garlic chains, sounds
bell, chants "Unclean! Unclean!"...) around the lanes of Norfolk and in the
Middle Of Nowhere was an elderly, very overweight guy trundling along the lanes
on his electric wheelchair at what was effectively walking speed... Seemed to
be a regular thing for him to do as he had a large flag inna recumbent stylee
hanging off the back of his chair. I was quite peturbed by this as the range of
this things isn't particularly big and if he got stranded in the Middle Of
Nowhere, I couldn't see how he was going to be able to get off and walk!

Cheers, helen s

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Simon Brooke said:

But secondly, and fortunately, you're not going to get less exercise.
You're going to get more. Because your electric bike has a heavy
battery with limited energy density. So for the first few miles of your
ride your better half is going to be pedalling along gently and
comfortably on her light, comfortable pedal cycle, and you're going to
be whirring along gently and comfortably beside her. And for the other
three quarters of your ride she's going to pedalling along gently and
comfortably on her light, comfortable pedal cycle, and you're going to
be pechting and panting along behind her, lugging the weight of that
useless battery and motor up every hill.

There's an easy solution to that problem:
Swap bikes when the battery runs out.
(Or get a moped.)

nick said:

Anyone here own up to riding one?

Yes, and the experience was described here:
<http://www.camcycle.org.uk/newsletters/25/article16.html>

Quoted message said:

Am thinking of getting one to extend the
range of my occasional bike trips,

It's unlikely to do this for you with the battery technology in use
today. If you can pedal 10 miles without assistance the electric bike
won't improve things, and if you can cycle 20 miles already it will
definitely be a burden.

Mike

"[Not Responding]" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

We've had an electric bike in the family for a few years, so I'm
qualified to comment on this one.

Unless your current trips are very short, you're not likely to
increase your cycling distance by much. My wife used hers for trips of
about 20 miles (ie 10 each way) but I suspect that was pushing the
limits of the battery capacity.

Also, if you're already cycling then you won't benefit from the
"psychological assist" that an electric motor gives. I think the
machines are great for getting non-cyclists out on bikes but, ime, the
evolution to an unassisted bike is then fairly rapid.

OTOH, as long as you approach them without too high expectations,
e-assist bikes are great. They are an environmentally friendly mode of
transport and one that gives you as much exercise as you choose.

However, I'd recommend that the best way for someone in your position
to 'extend range' would be to turn your occasional trips into regular
trips. Trust me, you'll soon put on the necessary muscle (it's also
noticable how rapidly it all drops off when you stop regular cycling).

Unless the knee is totally US then a good choice of low gears should
address that problem.

If you do go the e-bike route then I'd look at Heinzmann equipped
bikes. The system is retrofitted to bikes but, assuming a half-decent
base machine, you'll end up with a bike that is far superior in terms
of power:weight ratio and overall build quality than the Powabykes.

Thanks for the thoughtful comments. I have had a huge amount of negative
feedback on the weight and the absence of quality of the Powabyke range - so
that is well out of contention. Bikes have moved on in the last 20 years -
LOL, so I am having fun just visiting bike shops and seeing what there is.
I was amazed that Halfords had a half-decent looking hybrid (alu frame) for
under £180. So I might get one of these to play with first...

http://www.halfords.com/opd_product_details.asp?id=18878&type=0&cat=144

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Hi Simon,
I ride an electric bike every day, my favourite is the Panasonic
Pedalec, weighing just 16.9 kg and having a range of 20 miles, it
really makes sense on the hills around Surrey. It folds up small and
can be popped in the boot, so you are never without it.
Many 50+ rider have gained great benefit from such machines. Also
riding more often than a conventional machine because they are simply
more fun.

Simon Brooke <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

in message <[email hidden]>, nick

(') said:

Anyone here own up to riding one? Am thinking of getting one to
extend the range of my occasional bike trips, as my better half seems
to be developing
ever more stamina, whilst I seem to get less :-( At 50+ and with
a dodgy knee I am less keen to "work" at it, but can see the
attraction of a
the odd bit of discrete power assistance :-) Have worked out that
the Powabyke is a bit of a dinosaur whilst the Giant Lafree is one of
the better ones, but would welcome any views, comments, warnings, as I
am new to all this....

Well, I'm not going to be popular.

There are two problems with your suggestion.

First if you _were_ right in your suggestion that an electric bike would
result in you doing less work, you would be doing yourself no favours.
As we go towards old age (and I'm pretty much of an age with you) it is
very important in my opinion to keep the joints moving smoothly and the
lungs and heart well exercised. Yes, modern science can keep people
alive to ridiculous ages as helpless cripples, being bullied by 'care
assistants' to stagger with a zimmer frame from the seat in front of
the telly to the commode and back again, but do you really want to
become that person? I don't. So for the good of your health you
shouldn't be seeking to get less exercise, *particularly* at our age.

But secondly, and fortunately, you're not going to get less exercise.
You're going to get more. Because your electric bike has a heavy
battery with limited energy density. So for the first few miles of your
ride your better half is going to be pedalling along gently and
comfortably on her light, comfortable pedal cycle, and you're going to
be whirring along gently and comfortably beside her. And for the other
three quarters of your ride she's going to pedalling along gently and
comfortably on her light, comfortable pedal cycle, and you're going to
be pechting and panting along behind her, lugging the weight of that
useless battery and motor up every hill.

The lazy man does more work.

Of course, after trying this a couple of times the horrible contraption
will go into the back of the garden shed, where it will gradually
moulder and rust because 'cycling is too hard'. Cycling isn't too hard.
Cycling on a good bike isn't at all hard. And frankly for the price of
one of these abhominations you could get a very good bike which would
be a joy to use and keep you fit an mobile for another thirty or forty
years.

Electric Bikes Direct said:

I ride an electric bike every day...

Either your parents were remarkably prescient about your future
recreational habits and decided to name you accordingly or this is spam.

I know which option my money is on.

d.

On Wed, 29 Sep 2004 02:44:06 +0100, davek <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Electric Bikes Direct said:

I ride an electric bike every day...

How fast do they go ?? Could be good as a pacing machine :-)

Jack Ouzzi said:

On Wed, 29 Sep 2004 02:44:06 +0100, davek <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Electric Bikes Direct said:

I ride an electric bike every day...

How fast do they go ?? Could be good as a pacing machine :-)

15 mph -- so utterly useless for that application as well.

I'd love to see your aluminium 'Pedalec' haul its massive 17kg + rider
up the hills around Derbyshire with its puny 240W motor and 20 mile
range.

My Aluminium and Carbon Fibre Fondriest weighing less than 8kg manages
a spritely 10mph up the steepest hills and nearly 20mph on the flat
and has a range of 100 miles from it's 400w motor. And all this is
powered from a single bag of jelly babies !

Oh, and its cheaper than the Pedalec.

Perhaps you'd be kind enough to spam us again when the technology is
fit for purpose.

(Simon Smith) said:

My Aluminium and Carbon Fibre Fondriest weighing less than 8kg manages
a spritely 10mph up the steepest hills and nearly 20mph on the flat
and has a range of 100 miles from it's 400w motor. And all this is
powered from a single bag of jelly babies !

400 Watts? I'm not really sure - but I seem to recall reading that
Miguel Indurain only managed to sustain about 350 for a reaonable
duration (don't recall what that means in this context exactly) - and
he did better than the rest of the pros?

I suppose the duration is the thing... all of us can maintain a much
higher power output for a short sprint than we can for a day's ride.

Simonb said:

Jack Ouzzi said:

On Wed, 29 Sep 2004 02:44:06 +0100, davek <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Electric Bikes Direct wrote:
> I ride an electric bike every day...

How fast do they go ?? Could be good as a pacing machine :-)

15 mph -- so utterly useless for that application as well.

Hmm ... 2 wired together in series (or is it parallel) = 30 mph ??

quote='Paul Rudin' (Simon Smith) said:

My Aluminium and Carbon Fibre Fondriest weighing less than 8kg manages
a spritely 10mph up the steepest hills and nearly 20mph on the flat
and has a range of 100 miles from it's 400w motor. And all this is
powered from a single bag of jelly babies !

400 Watts? I'm not really sure - but I seem to recall reading that
Miguel Indurain only managed to sustain about 350 for a reaonable
duration (don't recall what that means in this context exactly) - and
he did better than the rest of the pros?

yes but was he powered by jelly babies? One of my favorite fuels....🙂

I recall reading somewhere that e bike riders covered 1200 miles per year opposed to normal bike riders doing 200 odd. Of course we all do more - but the point is they do get non bikers out more which can only be a good thing.
On a point of exercise my 97 year old neighbour with a duff knee makes a point of walking into town every day to keep herself mobile, she is fit, well and happy as opposed to my father 77 who sits infront of the TV and has trouble getting to the kitchen. Both have had hip opps but my father just stopped. My view Keep on truckin'....
Sniper8052

Sniper8052 said:

Paul Rudin said:

400 Watts? I'm not really sure - but I seem to recall reading that
Miguel Indurain only managed to sustain about 350 for a reaonable
duration (don't recall what that means in this context exactly) - and
he did better than the rest of the pros?

yes but was he powered by jelly babies? One of my favorite fuels....🙂

I recall reading somewhere that e bike riders covered 1200 miles per
year opposed to normal bike riders doing 200 odd. Of course we all do
more - but the point is they do get non bikers out more which can only
be a good thing.
On a point of exercise my 97 year old neighbour with a duff knee makes
a point of walking into town every day to keep herself mobile, she is
fit, well and happy as opposed to my father 77 who sits infront of the
TV and has trouble getting to the kitchen. Both have had hip opps but
my father just stopped. My view Keep on truckin'....
Sniper8052

Sniper,

do you think you could edit your posts properly so that your added content
doesn't appear with > down the side? This gives the impression that it is
the previous poster's comments and that you've added nothing. To work out
what you added to a post one has to go back to the post you are following
up first. Once people have to do this sort of thing they soon stop reading
offending posts, it's the easier option.

Colin

On Wed, 29 Sep 2004 17:00:51 +0100, "Colin Blackburn"
<[email hidden]> wrote (more or less):

Quoted message said:

Sniper8052 said:

Paul Rudin said:

400 Watts? I'm not really sure - but I seem to recall reading that
Miguel Indurain only managed to sustain about 350 for a reaonable
duration (don't recall what that means in this context exactly) - and
he did better than the rest of the pros?

yes but was he powered by jelly babies? One of my favorite fuels....🙂

I recall reading somewhere that e bike riders covered 1200 miles per
year opposed to normal bike riders doing 200 odd. Of course we all do
more - but the point is they do get non bikers out more which can only
be a good thing.
On a point of exercise my 97 year old neighbour with a duff knee makes
a point of walking into town every day to keep herself mobile, she is
fit, well and happy as opposed to my father 77 who sits infront of the
TV and has trouble getting to the kitchen. Both have had hip opps but
my father just stopped. My view Keep on truckin'....
Sniper8052

Sniper,

do you think you could edit your posts properly so that your added content
doesn't appear with > down the side? This gives the impression that it is
the previous poster's comments and that you've added nothing. To work out
what you added to a post one has to go back to the post you are following
up first. Once people have to do this sort of thing they soon stop reading
offending posts, it's the easier option.

Ah, is /that what's happening? I thought he was just forgetting to
add anything except his name!

--
Cheers,
Euan
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