soldering cable ends

On 23 Nov 2004 02:17:00 GMT, [email hidden] (Phil Brown)

Quoted message said:

This comes up every couple of months and a quick Google search would reveal
that if you use acid plumber's flux the solder will stick to your undoubtly
stainless cables. Use a propane torch, not an iron.

Even with an acid flux, it doesn't always work, and temperature
control is still a significant issue. Using a silver solder and
brazing flux is more likely to be successful; silver will stick to
just about anything.

--
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Athol said:

Mike said:

I'd like to solder the ends of my brake and shift cables, rather than
using the little crimp caps. I tried a couple of different solders,
and neither would stick to the cable. Any tricks or suggestions? I
googled Sheldon's site but didn't find a reference. Thanks.

Mike

Use phosphoric acid by dipping cable into the acid then solder.
Phosphoric acid is also the correct flux for soldering stainless steel.

Well I'll be darned. I tried that just as an experiment and got some
cables to take a flow when they previously wouldn't, but it was just
done on an offhand guess that etching the surface a bit could help.
(I keep a phosphoric acid bath around to remove corrosion from iron
and steel parts anyway, so I've usually got a jug of 85% phosphoric in
the acid cabinet. I would *not* recommend that just anyone mess with
an acid of that strength, though; it will eat holes in people quite
happily.)

For those not familiar, phosphoric acid is the active reagent in most
corrosion removal jel and liquid products like Naval Jelly, and in a
number of lime scale removers like CLR. In those products, the
concentration is reduced to a level that is unlikely to cause injury.
--
Typoes are a feature, not a bug.
Some gardening required to reply via email.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

Athol said:

Mike said:

I'd like to solder the ends of my brake and shift cables, rather than
using the little crimp caps. I tried a couple of different solders,
and neither would stick to the cable. Any tricks or suggestions? I
googled Sheldon's site but didn't find a reference. Thanks.

Mike

Use phosphoric acid by dipping cable into the acid then solder.
Phosphoric acid is also the correct flux for soldering stainless steel.

Well I'll be darned. I tried that just as an experiment and got some
cables to take a flow when they previously wouldn't, but it was just
done on an offhand guess that etching the surface a bit could help.
(I keep a phosphoric acid bath around to remove corrosion from iron
and steel parts anyway, so I've usually got a jug of 85% phosphoric in
the acid cabinet. I would *not* recommend that just anyone mess with
an acid of that strength, though; it will eat holes in people quite
happily.)

For those not familiar, phosphoric acid is the active reagent in most
corrosion removal jel and liquid products like Naval Jelly, and in a
number of lime scale removers like CLR. In those products, the
concentration is reduced to a level that is unlikely to cause injury.

Now all I have to do is remember this! Would someone please post a few
times over the next few weeks so the repetition shifts it into my long
term memory.

Repeat after me: Phosphoric acid (rust remover) works as a solder flux
on stainless cables.

David L. Johnson said:

But the cable would be impossible to re-insert due to fraying of the end.
Either solder, or nail polish, allows you to pull the cable, grease it,
and re-insert it.

That's why God invented slotted cable stops... you don't have to pull
the cable to clean and lube its entire length. The only time I pull a
cable is when I'm replacing the housing (which ain't all that often).

Mark Hickey
Habanero Cycles
http://www.habcycles.com
Home of the $695 ti frame

Mark Hickey said:

The only time I pull a

Quoted message said:

cable is when I'm replacing the housing (which ain't all that often).

You must have an interesting technique for removing brakes and derailers
then 😉

--
---
Marten Gerritsen

INFOapestaartjeM-GINEERINGpuntNL
www.m-gineering.nl

m-gineering said:

Mark Hickey said:

The only time I pull a

Quoted message said:

cable is when I'm replacing the housing (which ain't all that often).

You must have an interesting technique for removing brakes and derailers
then 😉

I do - when I remove 'em, I throw them out and replace 'em with new
ones (that is, I don't take derailleurs and brakes off the bike unless
they're worn out). OK, I have worked on a rear derailleur a time or
two off the bike... but you get the idea... ;-)

Mark Hickey
Habanero Cycles
http://www.habcycles.com
Home of the $695 ti frame

Forget the solder. Just use one drop of superglue. Works the same.

~AB~

"Bob Wheeler" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Mike said:

I'd like to solder the ends of my brake and shift cables, rather than
using the little crimp caps. I tried a couple of different solders,
and neither would stick to the cable. Any tricks or suggestions? I
googled Sheldon's site but didn't find a reference. Thanks.

Mike

The stainless steel cables are a problem; however, I find that by
repeating the treatment using a flux and solder compound will work. The
first time, the solder runs off, but sticks the second time. I have used
a 95/5 Tin/Antinomy mix, but I doubt that the proportions are critical
-- I have seen recommendations for a 50/50 mix.

--
Bob Wheeler --- http://www.bobwheeler.com/
ECHIP, Inc. ---
Randomness comes in bunches.

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<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Peter Cole said:

I don't screw around with solder/paint/glue any more. I just use new
cables. I find that I re-thread cables so rarely that replacement is

a good

Quoted message said:

idea anyway.

<irony>

I don't screw around with finding punctures, and replacing tubes any
more. I just throw away the whole wheel and replace it with another.
I mean, I rarely get more one puncture per month anyway, and given that
it's usually the rear, this means I don't have to worry about cassette
wear, either, as the new wheel comes with a new cassette.

</irony>

One of the things that a few cyclists around the place are into is
sustainability and environmental responsibility. If it works, then
don't throw it away. If it's broken, then at least make some attempt
at fixing it, and minimise the amount of stuff that you put in
land-fill. This sort of "just chuck it away" statement is really evil,
IMHO.

Regards,

Suzy

Now, Suzy -- I know you're an intelligent person (I've read your web site),
too intelligent to make such a qualitative rant on such thin quantitative
grounds. Removing cables is a very rare thing for me, so I find all the
attention (never mind the DIY chemistry) given to it kind of puzzling. I
find that shift cables last only a couple of years with the bar-end
shifters I favor, ditto for grip shift. These are consumables, just as
chains and sprockets are. I don't remove cables for periodic maintenance,
so there's no need to rethread them. I only cap the ends to prevent being
pricked by individual strands of wire when I'm handling the bikes.

Quantitatively, how many cables could you make from the steel in one chain?
One cassette? One frame? At the risk of sounding defensive, having recycled
several frames from the sidewalk on trash day, I'd say my enviro-karmic
account is well balanced. I still have my 30 year-old frame from college, a
nd my son rides (daily) my wife's frame of similar vintage. I'm an n-th
generation Yankee, and we take our frugality seriously.

BTW, not only do I not throw away wheels, I rebuild them, even crappy ones.
I have no limit on the number of patches I use on tubes, and even when
they're not repairable, I save them to wrap frame sections & make tie
downs. I even recycled a worn chain to make a chain whip (how many
cable-equivalents there?). I don't do these things out of some
enviro-consciousness, but more from being a Yankee engineer who abhors
waste. The major environmental impact of cycling (at least in my family) is
not from the diddly contributions to the waste stream (all of which go into
the recycle bin, BTW), but from daily use of bikes to commute to
work/school. Of course we don't ride bikes for environmental reasons,
they're just practical, economical, tools to get the job done, and more
pleasant than driving (we do have 2 cars and drive occasionally).

Token environmentalists tend to ritualistically perform a few symbolic acts
to support a screechy self-righteousness. Those of us who have been taking
it seriously (since the '60's) try to educate ourselves and stay abreast of
the important issues, like sprawl, watershed contamination, energy
efficiency/consumption, accumulating toxins, etc. I live in a small-ish
home, close to an urban area, support and participate in various local
environmental efforts, recycle religiously, eat very little meat, virtually
no seafood, etc., etc. I've tried to make my "footprint" as small as
possible. The reason I do all these things is not really ideological or
altruistic, I think they just simplify and improve the quality of my life.

It's the simplicity and efficiency of cycling that appeals to me, not its
environmental impact. Somehow all these things are connected. Less mess,
less fuss, more time, more pleasure out of life. I don't know if anything I
do or don't do makes much of an impact in the grand scheme of things, so
I'm disinclined to take a moral position on any of this. Anyway, I don't
think you can make people do things they don't want to do, and if you
attempt to, the cure may be worse than the disease. End of rant, but I do
think that if I have to prematurely discard a cable, I'll be able to live
with myself.

search to 'DIY cable solder'

HAVING DONE THAT I CAN ONLY REWRITE; THROW THE CABLES AWAY AND USE THE
TIP END CLAMPS
DOESN'T ANYONE SEARCH THE ARCHIVE?
where the expletive deleted is my slodering tip for the propane torch?

g.daniels said:

search to 'DIY cable solder'

HAVING DONE THAT I CAN ONLY REWRITE; THROW THE CABLES AWAY AND USE THE
TIP END CLAMPS
DOESN'T ANYONE SEARCH THE ARCHIVE?
where the expletive deleted is my slodering tip for the propane torch?

Went to Home Depot and got some liquid plastic,the stuff you coat tool handles with and it works pretty good on cables and comes in colors.

shokhead said:

g.daniels said:

search to 'DIY cable solder'

HAVING DONE THAT I CAN ONLY REWRITE; THROW THE CABLES AWAY AND USE THE
TIP END CLAMPS
DOESN'T ANYONE SEARCH THE ARCHIVE?
where the expletive deleted is my slodering tip for the propane torch?

Went to Home Depot and got some liquid plastic,the stuff you coat tool
handles with and it works pretty good on cables and comes in colors.

They didn't have purple. I'm not gonna use that stuff until they do.
--
Typoes are a feature, not a bug.
Some gardening required to reply via email.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

Bruce Graham <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

For those not familiar, phosphoric acid is the active reagent in most
corrosion removal jel and liquid products like Naval Jelly, and in a
number of lime scale removers like CLR. In those products, the
concentration is reduced to a level that is unlikely to cause injury.

Now all I have to do is remember this! Would someone please post a few
times over the next few weeks so the repetition shifts it into my long
term memory.

Repeat after me: Phosphoric acid (rust remover) works as a solder flux
on stainless cables.

That's what the web was invented for, so you can make links, and don't
have to remember. (yeah right)

"You can't get lost in Southern California because they've paved the
whole thing" --unknown

dkl

Quoted message said:

Even with an acid flux, it doesn't always work, and temperature
control is still a significant issue. Using a silver solder and
brazing flux is more likely to be successful; silver will stick to
just about anything.

Always works for me but maybe I'm better with heat. I don't think so cause I
just heat it until the flux melts-about 3 seconds-and flow the solder. Works
every time.
Phil Brown

In article <oQIod.75809$V41.32238@attbi_s52>,

Peter Cole said:

Quoted message said:

Regards,

Suzy

Now, Suzy -- I know you're an intelligent person...

Peter,

Great Post! That's exactly what I was going to say but mine came out as
"hmmmphhh uhhhhhh [censored] mmm yeah"

This whole soldering thing confuses me. The Bowden cable was invented more than
100 years ago and the nipples and ends were soldered. Works beautifully. But
there seems to be resistance to doing it here on r.b.t. I just wonder why. Ends
don't fray, cables can be reused easily, woirks great. the wheel doesn't need
to be reinvented every few years, some things work and continue to work.
Phil Brown

On 24 Nov 2004 03:48:44 GMT, [email hidden] (Phil Brown)

Quoted message said:

This whole soldering thing confuses me. The Bowden cable was invented more than
100 years ago and the nipples and ends were soldered. Works beautifully. But
there seems to be resistance to doing it here on r.b.t. I just wonder why. Ends
don't fray, cables can be reused easily, woirks great. the wheel doesn't need
to be reinvented every few years, some things work and continue to work.

Anyone can successfully crimp a cap on the end of a cable of any
material with essentially no training and minimal tooling. Soldering
the ends may have come second-nature to you with just the stuff you
had on hand or could obtain nearby, but that is not the case for
everyone. People who have not had satisfactory results from soldering
often try other solutions, and pass along what they've found to work,
for the benefit of those who also can't get the cable to accept the
solder.
--
Typoes are a feature, not a bug.
Some gardening required to reply via email.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

Fake name goes here said:

Great Post! That's exactly what I was going to say but mine came out

as

Quoted message said:

"hmmmphhh uhhhhhh [censored] mmm yeah"

Good to see I can annoy ya 🙂
Regards,

Suzy (not hiding behind an anonymous post)

"Fake name goes here" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <oQIod.75809$V41.32238@attbi_s52>,

Peter Cole said:

Quoted message said:

Regards,

Suzy

Now, Suzy -- I know you're an intelligent person...

Peter,

Great Post! That's exactly what I was going to say but mine came out as
"hmmmphhh uhhhhhh [censored] mmm yeah"

I feel I know her somewhat from her posts over the years & web site, and
she knows her stuff:
<http://www.atnf.csiro.au/people/Suzy.Jackson/bike_frame.html>

I admit to being a little disappointed that she'd jump to (unflattering)
conclusions about me, but then I haven't put in the time on a web site
"showcasing" myself the way she has. It's easy to get the wrong idea about
someone in this medium, I don't think it really merits the b-term.

On 23 Nov 2004 02:17:00 GMT [email hidden] (Phil Brown)

Quoted message said:

This comes up every couple of months and a quick Google search would reveal
that if you use acid plumber's flux the solder will stick to your undoubtly
stainless cables. Use a propane torch, not an iron.

Why do you prefer a torch? Assuming you're using soft solder, which
would be the appropriate kind to work with plumber's flux, an iron
will be plenty hot and it won't burn the flux like an open flame will.

-
-----------------------------------------------
Jim Adney [email hidden]
Madison, WI 53711 USA
-----------------------------------------------

Quoted message said:

Why do you prefer a torch? Assuming you're using soft solder, which
would be the appropriate kind to work with plumber's flux, an iron
will be plenty hot and it won't burn the flux like an open flame will

The iron takes to long to heat itself up and too long to do the job. Fire the
torch, flux the cable, heat it, touch the solder, wipe with steel wool, done
and it takes about that long. Who cares if you burn the flux? You're not
running water under pressure.
Phil Brown