RailBikes

[email hidden] (john riley) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

"Mark Leuck" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<Hoh0c.5796$PR3.130515@attbi_s03>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Since I already know the subject I'd rather not see it a zillion times during the thread but
instead like to see the replies, if it annoys some well sorry but I'm more annoyed scrolling
down to see a one line reply

Or having to scroll down, and _then_ go to another screen to see the one line reply. That's
better? That's stupid.

Yes, I do agree with John and Mark here. If you are just giving a one line reply, then all you need
do is just provide the barest context above. Some posters are notorious for doing what you so aptly
describe as "stupid" (Lorenzo Love of Bigha fame).

As you well know, I am almost incapable of a one line reply to anything. Even when I am just calling
someone an idiot, I do know how to go on and on doing it for several paragraphs! Sometimes if the
message I am replying to is not too long I will include all of it because that is what I am replying
to. But if I am just replying to a segment of a very long message, then that is all that needs to be
included for context.

I am convinced that some just do not know how to edit. Technically, they know how to edit, but not
according to the thought that you are addressing in the message to which you are responding. You
need only include enough to give the reader context. In fact, that is the secret: to pretend that
you are a reader who knows next to nothing of what has been said heretofore. Most readers are way to
lazy to go back and read all the messages in a thread in order to acquire context.

Freewheeling has a very interesting way of posting. He will edit for context above and then reply
and then include the entire post to which he is responding below at the very bottom. I think this
may be technically the most correct way of doing it, but I do note one of the previous posters in
this thread who complained that this really slows down his dial up connection. I think it is
basically overkill for ARBR, but I think scholars and intellectuals would probably do it this way.
It does in fact provide perfect context for all those who will come after.

For the most part I always thought Mr. Sherman had it about right. Occasionally I thought he was
trimming some of my posts too much and occasionally he would repeat my entire post when he was just
giving a one line reply (he did that just to irritate me I am sure), but for the most part he was
very good at getting his posts right.

The real secret to correct posting is not to be so lazy all the time taking shortcuts. If you have a
proper respect for your readers, you won't take shortcuts but will do everything possible to help
the reader understand your message without confusion.

Regards,

Ed Dolan - Minnesota

Sticker Jim' from said:

Netiquette Guidelines

"Guidelines" ?? Yeah, well that sounds pretty much "engraved in stone". Not. So, like I said, it's
merely a recommendation and neither a rule nor a law.

You're right. And eating a formal dinner with your fingers is OK, too. After all, there's no law or
rule that you have to use utensils.

--
[email hidden]
The inconsistency principle.
84

"David Reuteler" skrev...

Quoted message said:

thanks ed, that was great. besides being pretty mean spirited was there a point to all that? or
was it just that we (except for you and tom) are all in the wrong so everything is ok? kind of a
posting nihilist or should we all be striving for some kind of properly edited bottom posting
nirvana?

Ed is our local village idiot, troll or very grumpy old man here on ARBR. Possibly all three.
Whatever it is he doesn't have a life. If you could get him to change to RBM we would all worship
the ground you walk on. ;o)

Cheers Mikael

On Mon, 01 Mar 2004 22:08:41 -0600, Tom Sherman <[email hidden]> from

Mostly Disorganized said:

Mr. Dolan enjoys being disagreeable, and especially enjoys disagreeing with me. [1] His favorite
expression is "left wing extremist wacko nuts".

You rang?

--
[email hidden]
Discard an axiom.
53

David Reuteler <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

In rec.bicycles.misc Edward Dolan <[email hidden]> wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

As to trimming (editing), yes, but too much trimming is worse than too little. The problem is
that some on this newsgroup simply do not know how to edit because they do not know how to
think. "Sticker Jim" is the foremost example that I can think of, but there are many others here
who trim way too much. At the other extreme are those who trim nothing but simply post the whole
mess at the top or at the bottom of their message. It's like look Ma ... no brains!

About the only good editor here I ever knew was Mr. Tom Sherman. I am not bad, but I am not
perfect either. Frankly, it takes brains to know how to edit.

Ed Dolan - Minnesota

thanks ed, that was great. besides being pretty mean spirited was there a point to all that? or
was it just that we (except for you and tom) are all in the wrong so everything is ok? kind of a
posting nihilist or should we all be striving for some kind of properly edited bottom posting
nirvana?

your post was actually hard to trim since you left no summary so i just left most of it intact.

I only summarize what I have said if my post is fairly lengthy with many component parts. Mostly I
try to confine whatever it is I have to say to a couple of medium length paragraphs which do not
require any summarization.

As to your post, here is a tip for you from someone who has spent his life reading books, magazines
and newspapers. Always capitalize that which needs to be capitalized. Your short cut in that respect
is nothing but lazy and sloppy and shows disrespect for the reader. Your post looks God awful
because you don't capitalize. Not even my name! One other thing you could do to improve your posts
is to sign off with your name even though it is in your address above. Why? Because it just looks
better. Looks count!

You did bottom post and edit my post properly in that you were responding to it in its entirety.
There was no need to trim my post, not even the first paragraph.

As to my being mean spirited, these characters who think it is OK to post however they want do not
deserve our tolerance. They are scofflaws and need to be treated as such. I am not going to make
this my mission here on ARBR, but when directly challenged on the subject, I will give my opinion in
no uncertain terms.

Some folks post here much better than others. I think Tom and I are at the top of the list. That is
most likely because we take some pains with our posts to make sure they are correct and look right.
The main thing of course is always to communicate something of substance, but form is equally
important. If a post looks sloppy and unkempt the content is usually the same way.

I am glad you picked up on my self parody about me not being "perfect".

Regards,

Ed Dolan - Minnesota

Tom Sherman <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]-
berlin.de>... [...]

Quoted message said:

Mr. Dolan enjoys being disagreeable, and especially enjoys disagreeing with me. [1] His favorite
expression is "left wing extremist wacko nuts". You can make him happy by giving him a chance
to insult you.

I don't go looking for trouble, but when trouble finds me I don't run away from it either.

Ed Dolan - Minnesota

"Mikael Seierup" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

"David Reuteler" skrev...

Quoted message said:

thanks ed, that was great. besides being pretty mean spirited was there a point to all that? or
was it just that we (except for you and tom) are all in the wrong so everything is ok? kind of a
posting nihilist or should we all be striving for some kind of properly edited bottom posting
nirvana?

Ed is our local village idiot, troll or very grumpy old man here on ARBR. Possibly all three.
Whatever it is he doesn't have a life. If you could get him to change to RBM we would all worship
the ground you walk on. ;o)

Cheers Mikael

Mikael is a kill filer like so many others here on ARBR and so he most likely only reads me when
others are quoting me in their responses to my posts. So he is never getting what I say in its
entirety. Yet he feels he is qualified to comment on me nonetheless. My feeling is that if you have
kill filed someone, then you are no longer in a position to make any further comments on the person
you have kill filed.

It is ironic that Mikael would suggest that I get a life when he is offering his two cents worth
here on this newsgroup much more frequently than I am. Of course, his posts are very short as he
never has much to say about anything. But like I said, what he does have to say is worth about
two cents.

If I left this newsgroup it would be the dullest place in the world. Even Mr. Sherman needs me here
to bounce off of. If Mr. Sherman and I were BOTH to leave, that would be the end of ARBR, unless you
want to spend all eternity discussing the same old topics over and over ad nauseam. Only the fools
and idiots would remain here for that kind of discussion.

Ed Dolan - Minnesota

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

In rec.bicycles.misc Luigi de Guzman <[email hidden]> wrote:
> your flagrant disregard and disdain for the regular and established etiquette on r.b.m. is
> pretty good grounds for your being killfiled.

well, he's certainly not picking his battles very well.

Not too concerned about "picking fights" or who is concerned about my ability to supposedly
pick them.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Who?

sticker jim.

see, i'm a crappy editor. i have much to learn.
--
david reuteler

Going through the posts, at least half the posts are top post, from numerous people. I don't
recall seeing ongoing whining about their posts, some of them quite long too. Mind you, they
didn't voice their opinions on the subject like I did, nor did they point out that the much
vaunted RFC 1855 was merely a guideline like I did either. Obviously, that was what seemed to [censored]
some people off the most.

While some/many/all may have kill filed me, that's entirely their choice. I've KF'd the biggest
whiners about top posting too. I wish my life was so simple and devoid of content that "top posting"
could be one of my siren songs too. Not.

That's right. Look around the planet and you might see that there could be more people that eat
without utensils than those that do. If it was an attempt at sarcasm, you missed the mark, IMO.

"Kevan Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >

Quoted message said:

You're right. And eating a formal dinner with your fingers is OK, too.

After

Quoted message said:

all, there's no law or rule that you have to use utensils.

Kevan Smith said:

Sticker Jim' from said:

Netiquette Guidelines

"Guidelines" ?? Yeah, well that sounds pretty much "engraved in stone". Not. So, like I said, it's
merely a recommendation and neither a rule nor a law.

You're right. And eating a formal dinner with your fingers is OK, too. After all, there's no law or
rule that you have to use utensils.

Actually...there is a *proper* way to eat with one's fingers, in cultures where this is the norm.

My father was very insistent that I learn to eat with my hands properly. For us, this means using
the four fingers of the right hand as a scoop to gather rice with, and then to push the mound that
forms politely into your mouth with the thumb. It works very well, and you don't end up with all
this rice all over you.

-Luigi

Edward Dolan said:

If I left this newsgroup it would be the dullest place in the world.

You forgot the smiley face thing.

Bill "either that, or you'll pinch-flat hauling that ego around" S.

In rec.bicycles.misc Luigi de Guzman said:

Kevan Smith said:

You're right. And eating a formal dinner with your fingers is OK, too. After all, there's no law
or rule that you have to use utensils.

Quoted message said:

Actually...there is a *proper* way to eat with one's fingers, in cultures where this is the norm.

Mmmmm, Ethiopean food. Mmmm, Injera. I think there are something like ten Ethiopean restaurants near
house, not to mention the various coptic Churches.

--
Dane Jackson - z u v e m b i @ u n i x b i g o t s . o r g /earth is 98% full ... please delete
anyone you can.

In rec.bicycles.misc Edward Dolan said:

As to your post, here is a tip for you from someone who has spent his life reading books,
magazines and newspapers. Always capitalize that which needs to be capitalized. Your short cut in
that respect is nothing but lazy and sloppy and shows disrespect for the reader.

but, ed, i have no respect for this reader.
--
david reuteler

"Sticker Jim" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

[...]

Quoted message said:

While some/many/all may have kill filed me, that's entirely their choice. I've KF'd the biggest
whiners about top posting too. I wish my life was so simple and devoid of content that "top
posting" could be one of my siren songs too. Not.

I will never kill file you although I have come to despise you and your confounded opinions. Only
cowards kill file. No, I will always be here for you and your despicable and wrongheaded opinions on
posting - and everything else too.

Maybe you won't see my posts, but everyone else here will see them. If I were going to be a
contentious [censored] like yourself I think I would want to see what is being said about me on ARBR.

God! Another ostrich. Cletus and Mikael ... move over. Here is another nut and screwball for your
little club of know nothings.

Ed Dolan - Minnesota

[email hidden] (Edward Dolan) wrote in message

Quoted message said:

If I left this newsgroup....Only the fools and idiots would remain here for that kind of
discussion.

Maybe, but at least we would be rid of one of the "fool and idiots."

You still don't have a clue!

Perry B - Minnesota

[email hidden] (Edward Dolan) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Some folks post here much better than others. I think Tom and I are at the top of the list.
That is most likely because we take some pains with our posts to make sure they are correct and
look right.

That just shows that you're as anal as Tom. Of course, the difference between you and Tom is, I
believe, Tom recognizes how anal he is and he seems to enjoy it, whereas you confuse being anal as
perfection. In fact, you're so anal that you ALWAYS have to get the last word in.

You still don't have a clue!

Perry B - Minnesota

Top posting is inexcusable!

Tom Sherman - Quad Cities (Illinois Side)

Sticker Jim said:

Going through the posts, at least half the posts are top post, from numerous people. I don't
recall seeing ongoing whining about their posts, some of them quite long too. Mind you, they
didn't voice their opinions on the subject like I did, nor did they point out that the much
vaunted RFC 1855 was merely a guideline like I did either. Obviously, that was what seemed to [censored]
some people off the most.

While some/many/all may have kill filed me, that's entirely their choice. I've KF'd the biggest
whiners about top posting too. I wish my life was so simple and devoid of content that "top
posting" could be one of my siren songs too. Not.

I'm really curious about bottom posters. Do they empty their trash from one receptacle into another
so the oldest garbage will be on top.

I view the messages as disposable. Once I have read them they go into the heap. The old garbage is
at the bottom. IF, I have thrown out something of value, then I will dig through the refuse to
recover it.

William "the bottom feeding top-poster" Higley, Sr. Vision R-50 RANS Rocket "Tom Sherman"
<[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Top posting is inexcusable!

Tom Sherman - Quad Cities (Illinois Side)

Sticker Jim said:

Going through the posts, at least half the posts are top post, from

numerous

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

people. I don't recall seeing ongoing whining about their posts, some

of

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

them quite long too. Mind you, they didn't voice their opinions on the subject like I did, nor
did they point out that the much vaunted RFC

1855

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

was merely a guideline like I did either. Obviously, that was what

seemed

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

to [censored] some people off the most.

While some/many/all may have kill filed me, that's entirely their

choice.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I've KF'd the biggest whiners about top posting too. I wish my life was

so

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

simple and devoid of content that "top posting" could be one of my siren songs too. Not.

"S o r n i" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Edward Dolan said:

If I left this newsgroup it would be the dullest place in the world.

You forgot the smiley face thing.

Bill "either that, or you'll pinch-flat hauling that ego around" S.

I debated that smiley face thing a long time ago with myself and decided against it. Those who know
how to read will get my meaning and humor and those who don't know how to read will be clueless. I
am guessing that you got my meaning and humor just fine.

Ed Dolan - Minnesota

David Reuteler <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

In rec.bicycles.misc Edward Dolan <[email hidden]> wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

As to your post, here is a tip for you from someone who has spent his life reading books,
magazines and newspapers. Always capitalize that which needs to be capitalized. Your short cut
in that respect is nothing but lazy and sloppy and shows disrespect for the reader.

but, ed, i have no respect for this reader.

It is immaterial whether or not you respect me. It is respect for any of the others here on this
newsgroup who may want to read your message. I know this is hard for you to grasp as you have a way
of never saying anything, but there are lots of idle folks here who have nothing better to do than
to read asinine ramblings such as yours. So you might at least show all these other folks some
respect and you could began to do so by capitalizing that which needs to be capitalized. And sign
your name to your posts too so that the rest of us can distinguish one jackass from another.

And no, you are not going to palm me off on that other newsgroup either. I like all the nuts and
screwballs here on ARBR because they are my kind of nuts and screwballs.

Ed Dolan - Minnesota