Quitting a marathon

"Donovan Rebbechi" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Tim said:

I've run 2 marathons and at several times during both i thought of
quitting.Thankfully i didnt. I think i would have suffered far greater
by quitting than the temporary physical pain i endured during the
marathon. There is no greater feeling than finishing a marathon. No task
in life seems impossible to me anymore.

It is really bad to DNF unless you're injured. You'll "feel like" quitting

in

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any race that you run at the edge of your ability. You have a choice each

time,

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and you must make the right choice each time. If you ever do DNF, you

seriously

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need to review your approach to both training and racing, until you

understand

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what went wrong and how you're going to fix it.

Cheers,
--
Donovan Rebbechi
http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/

And you've finished how many marathons?

Parker Race said:

And you've finished how many marathons?

Though I train harder than most marathoners, I haven't competed in the marathon
distance. However I'm not judging her either. I'm just pointing out that a DNF
isn't a terribly good outcome.

Maybe you should save your "tough questions" for those who are accusing her
of being a wimp.

Cheers,
--
Donovan Rebbechi
http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/

[email hidden] (TheBillRodgerz) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

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No. But she wasn't just running for herself.

THAT is the point! She was running for us, this decrepid rundown country, and
the miserable [censored] had no right to quit. She should marry Kerry, with two
faces like that, we'd rename them the "Bassett twins".

LOL, LOL!!!

[email hidden] (Edward) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I've run about 10 marathons and quit the last one. I was aiming for
sub 3; arrived at half way in 1:29 more or less all-in, and stepped
off the road. This was London 2003. I can see absolutely no gain in
carrying on running if you're not going to achieve your goal. If your
goal is just to finish, then carry on running. If your goal is an
Olympic medal and you're 4th with no realistic expectation of
improving, then quit. It's not like she had to prove that she could
finish, is it?

I agree. No sense in carrying on when she wasn't going to medal,
particularly when she was probably at highly elevated risk for injury.

I think most Brits would rather have a healthy Paula Radcliffe after
the Marathon than one who struggled to finish 7th and injured herself
in the process.

Donovan Rebbechi said:

Parker Race said:

And you've finished how many marathons?

Though I train harder than most marathoners, I haven't competed in the marathon
distance.

You haven't even done a friggin' marathon?!?! ROTFL.

All this strutting and pontificating on the mental toughness needed
and you haven't even done one?!?!

Sorry, but that's like the Pope arguing about Johnny "The Wad" Holmes'
sex techniques.

Mike Tennent
"IronPenguin"

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Wouldn't that be quitting?

No, it would never starting. In order to quit a race, you must first start it.
You can't DNF if you DNS.

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You haven't even done a friggin' marathon?!?! ROTFL.

I know, I was just waiting for you to type that LOL!

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All this strutting and pontificating on the mental toughness needed
and you haven't even done one?!?!

He's like the sad relative with no kids, who constantly harps on how you should
raise your kids.

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Sorry, but that's like the Pope arguing about Johnny "The Wad" Holmes'
sex techniques.

You don't think The Pope has all his flicks?

Mike Tennent said:

Donovan Rebbechi said:

Parker Race said:

And you've finished how many marathons?

Though I train harder than most marathoners, I haven't competed in the marathon
distance.

You haven't even done a friggin' marathon?!?! ROTFL.

All this strutting and pontificating on the mental toughness needed

Allow me to remind you that it is you and not I who criticise the "mental toughness"
of others. I did not criticise your mental toughness or anyone elses.

When I do decide that I wish to criticise these athletes, I will equip myself of the
appropriate qualifications first. Until then, I will treat them with respect.

HTH,
--
Donovan Rebbechi
http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/

"Donovan Rebbechi" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Parker Race said:

And you've finished how many marathons?

Though I train harder than most marathoners, I haven't competed in the

marathon

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distance. However I'm not judging her either. I'm just pointing out that a

DNF

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isn't a terribly good outcome.

Maybe you should save your "tough questions" for those who are accusing

her

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of being a wimp.

Cheers,
--
Donovan Rebbechi
http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/

It's not a tough question, just pointing out that you haven't experienced
the agony that a marathon can turn in to. Training like a marathoner and
racing a marathon are not equivalent experiences.
My wife ran 3:03 last Fall but was ready to dropout of Boston this year. She
credits running into people she knew who encouraged her as the reason for
finishing.

Parker Race said:

"Donovan Rebbechi" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Parker Race said:

And you've finished how many marathons?

Though I train harder than most marathoners, I haven't competed in the
marathon distance. However I'm not judging her either. I'm just pointing out
that a DNF isn't a terribly good outcome.

Maybe you should save your "tough questions" for those who are accusing her
of being a wimp.

It's not a tough question, just pointing out that you haven't experienced
the agony that a marathon can turn in to. Training like a marathoner and
racing a marathon are not equivalent experiences.

I agree that I'm not in much of a position to criticise anyone, but the fact
remains that a DNF is not a good outcome. Therefore it's a good idea for
someone who DNFs to determine the cause, and devise a strategy to prevent it in
future.

I have little doubt that any athlete as hard working and focussed as Paula
Radcliffe would indeed do some deep thinking about this.

Cheers,
--
Donovan Rebbechi
http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/

Donovan Rebbechi <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Edward said:

[email hidden] (Tim) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I've run 2 marathons and at several times during both i thought of
quitting.Thankfully i didnt. I think i would have suffered far greater
by quitting than the temporary physical pain i endured during the
marathon. There is no greater feeling than finishing a marathon. No task
in life seems impossible to me anymore.
Tim

I've run about 10 marathons and quit the last one. I was aiming for
sub 3; arrived at half way in 1:29 more or less all-in, and stepped
off the road. This was London 2003. I can see absolutely no gain in
carrying on running if you're not going to achieve your goal. If your

I'd say that if the goal that you've set yourself makes a quitter of you
instead of bringing out the best in you, it doesn't serve a useful purpose.

Most of the time you talk sense, but here you're just totatlly
clueless. Do you know nothing about Paula Radcliffe's history? Your
penny-ante cod-psychology does you no credit whatsoever. However, for
your benefit: Paula's goal was the perfectly reasonable one of
winning the Olympic marathon (she has, after all, run three minutes
faster than anyone else for the distance). At the time she stopped
running, she had absolutely no chance whatsoever of winning. What
possible gain could there be in her finishing in 10th or 14th or 23rd
place?

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You owe it to yourself to make an honest effort in any race you enter.

Are you trying to say that she didn't make an honest effort? Boy,
you're really off the mark today!

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goal is just to finish, then carry on running. If your goal is an
Olympic medal and you're 4th with no realistic expectation of
improving, then quit.

I disagree, and I think Paula needs to sit down and have a really long talk
with her coach after that.

And her coach would say exactly the same as me - obey your instincts.
In an extensive pre-race interview with Steve Cram, Paula made exactly
that point. Although she had a race plan, it was entirely at the
mercy of her instincts, and what her body was telling her. Her body
and her instincts told her to quit - only the truly hard of thinking
could find any fault in that. In a later, post-race interview, again
with Steve Cram, she said that she had absolutely nothing in her legs
from about half way, and that at the time she dropped out she doubted
whether she could have walked to the finish.

Finally, she probably had in the back of her mind that she is entered
for the 10,000 metres and, as one of the fastest at that distance, has
a good shot at gold too.

Edward

Donovan Rebbechi <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Edward said:

"Phil M." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

[email hidden] (Edward) wrote:

> [email hidden] (Tim) wrote in message
> news:<[email hidden]>...
>> I've run 2 marathons and at several times during both i thought of
>> quitting.Thankfully i didnt. I think i would have suffered far
>> greater by quitting than the temporary physical pain i endured
>> during the marathon. There is no greater feeling than finishing a
>> marathon. No task in life seems impossible to me anymore.
>> Tim
>
> I've run about 10 marathons and quit the last one. I was aiming for
> sub 3; arrived at half way in 1:29 more or less all-in, and stepped
> off the road. This was London 2003. I can see absolutely no gain in
> carrying on running if you're not going to achieve your goal. If your
> goal is just to finish, then carry on running. If your goal is an
> Olympic medal and you're 4th with no realistic expectation of
> improving, then quit. It's not like she had to prove that she could
> finish, is it?

No. But she wasn't just running for herself.

Who else was she running for, in this context? It's not a team event,

England. She was chosen to represent her country.

There are no "unattached" athletes in the olympics.

Duh! Actually she's representing Great Britain. Not that it makes a
jot of difference to my argument - GB's Olympic Team doesn't expect
its athletes to commit suicide simply because they're in a race. As
far as the team is concerned, the welfare of the athlete comes before
any potential benefit that might accrue from the race (health before
medals). If the athlete isn't going to win a medal, then the team's
ONLY interest is the athlete's welfare.

Just in case you think I'm talking through my [censored], I telephoned my
training partner who ran 800m for GB in many athletics events
(including World Championships, Olympics etc.), and who knows Paula
reasonably well, and he told me categorically that she had done the
right thing, and that there would be absolutely NO repercussions from
the GB team. He was gutted about her having to step off the road, but
he also said that there is no way she'd have done that if she could
physically have continued. She is NOT a quitter.

I'm responding to you, rather than Bill Rogers or one of his sock
puppets, because you are generally on the money in any serious
discussion. Here, I'm sorry to say, you are just wrong.

Edward
--
The reading group's reading group:
http://www.bookgroup.org.uk

"Edward" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Finally, she probably had in the back of her mind that she is entered
for the 10,000 metres and, as one of the fastest at that distance, has
a good shot at gold too.

You mean we might have to see her again? It's difficult just watching that
head bob. Is it always that bad?

Tim <[email hidden]> wrote:
.....

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No task in life seems impossible to me anymore.
Tim

Cool. How about doing the Badwater race or the Appalachian trail? ;-)

Edward said:

Donovan Rebbechi <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Edward said:

[email hidden] (Tim) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...
> I've run 2 marathons and at several times during both i thought of
> quitting.Thankfully i didnt. I think i would have suffered far greater
> by quitting than the temporary physical pain i endured during the
> marathon. There is no greater feeling than finishing a marathon. No task
> in life seems impossible to me anymore.
> Tim

I've run about 10 marathons and quit the last one. I was aiming for
sub 3; arrived at half way in 1:29 more or less all-in, and stepped
off the road. This was London 2003. I can see absolutely no gain in
carrying on running if you're not going to achieve your goal. If your

I'd say that if the goal that you've set yourself makes a quitter of you
instead of bringing out the best in you, it doesn't serve a useful purpose.

Most of the time you talk sense, but here you're just totatlly
clueless. Do you know nothing about Paula Radcliffe's history? Your
penny-ante cod-psychology does you no credit whatsoever. However, for

What are you blabbing about ? I'm not the one who is accusing her of being a
coward. Go yell at someone who is, either Bill or Mike (who thinks that doing a
6 hour marathon means he's qualified to judge one of the worlds greatest
athletes).

However, I don't agree with this idea of yours that you should quit every race
where you fall behind on your time goal. If I had that attitude, I'd probably
quit about half the races I enter. I think there are a very few cases that I'd
consider exceptions (e.g. you're trying to qualify for a race) but I think we
simply have a fundamental difference of opinion here.

There was a race I DNFd for exactly that reason (I was falling behind on a time
goal). It was a short race (2 miles) but it hurt like hell and I was fading.
The decision to DNF is something I regret more than any other decision I've
made as a runner. Even though my instincts said that it was "OK" at the time.

Quoted message said:

your benefit: Paula's goal was the perfectly reasonable one of
winning the Olympic marathon (she has, after all, run three minutes
faster than anyone else for the distance). At the time she stopped
running, she had absolutely no chance whatsoever of winning. What
possible gain could there be in her finishing in 10th or 14th or 23rd
place?

IMO that's a better outcome than a DNF.

Cheers,
--
Donovan Rebbechi
http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/

(Tim) said:

I've run 2 marathons and at several times during both i thought of
quitting.Thankfully i didnt. I think i would have suffered far greater
by quitting than the temporary physical pain i endured during the
marathon.

Then you weren't really in any risk of physical injury at all.

I dropped out of a 240km race after 103km because I knew that I couldn't
finish within the time limit and that I would really screw myself up
physically for a long time, if a kept going until eliminated at the
180km checkpoint.

It was the single most intelligent decision of my running career. An
even better one would have been not to start but that's another story.

steve common said:

(Tim) said:

I've run 2 marathons and at several times during both i thought of
quitting.Thankfully i didnt. I think i would have suffered far greater
by quitting than the temporary physical pain i endured during the
marathon.

Then you weren't really in any risk of physical injury at all.

I dropped out of a 240km race after 103km because I knew that I couldn't
finish within the time limit and that I would really screw myself up
physically for a long time, if a kept going until eliminated at the
180km checkpoint.

It was the single most intelligent decision of my running career. An
even better one would have been not to start but that's another story.

I take it that the line of argument here is that the toll of the race on your
body is an important consideration.

Question: what is the shortest distance for which you'd consider this a good
reason to DNF ?

I wouldn't consider it a good reason to DNF for any distance that I've raced
before, but then the longest I've raced is the half.

Cheers,
--
Donovan Rebbechi
http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/

Quoted message said:

You mean we might have to see her again? It's difficult just watching that
head bob. Is it always that bad?

It's like watching the soft [censored] version of "Deep throat".

"Donovan Rebbechi" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

There was a race I DNFd for exactly that reason (I was falling behind on a

time

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goal). It was a short race (2 miles) but it hurt like hell and I was

fading.

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The decision to DNF is something I regret more than any other decision

I've

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made as a runner. Even though my instincts said that it was "OK" at the

time.

Your running doesn't even compare to Paula's running so you are in position
to question her. It would be like me strutting around laughing at Peja
Stojakovich because Peja airballed a 3 pointer that would have beat the
Lakers in the 7th game of the NBA western conference finals. The fact that
I can make a lot of threes makes no difference as I would have no comparable
experience.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

your benefit: Paula's goal was the perfectly reasonable one of
winning the Olympic marathon (she has, after all, run three minutes
faster than anyone else for the distance). At the time she stopped
running, she had absolutely no chance whatsoever of winning. What
possible gain could there be in her finishing in 10th or 14th or 23rd
place?

IMO that's a better outcome than a DNF.

For you maybe. For her the goal is winning and nothing else. Finishing
means nothing as a lot of people can finish a marathon.

Quoted message said:

Cheers,
--
Donovan Rebbechi
http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/

[censored] talker.