MTB upgrade - advise please

in message <[email hidden]>,

(') said:

Hi group,

I'm thinking of upgrading my MTB and finally retiring my Rigid '93
Marin Bear Valley SE which I rebuilt with full XTR in 1995. I've
accepted that full-suspension is the order of the day and that I want
something that will soak up the downhills with abundence and with
decent braking performance (i.e. hydraulic discs). I also fancy doing
some XC racing, so need a bike that is relatively lightweight and where
the suspension does not impact on climbing performance.

Based on this, I'm between an '06 Marin Mount Vision and an '06
Specialized Epic.

I don't think an Epic is going to be competitive in XC. Indeed I don't
think any full suspension bike is going to be competitive unless you're
very strong. You also aren't going to get anything which is strong
enough to 'soak up the downhills with abundance' and also be competitive
in XC - unless you're skilled enough to take a lightweight bike down.

If you want to be competitive /and/ you want full suspension consider a
Cannondale Rush, which is usefully light and very competent. There are
various other light full suspension frames, but the frame is a
relatively small component of the overall weight of the bike, and no
other fork has the stiffness to weight ratio of a Lefty.

Also be aware with the Epic that that very expensive suspension strut is
stuck out there in all the mud and dirt, which may be OK in dry
Californian conditions but isn't a good plan in UK conditions. Mind you,
the Mount Vision puts a whole lot of over-complicated and vulnerable
suspension linkages under the bottom bracket, which is also not clever

YAY! Go Kate Cullen! That's another bronze!

Sorry, normal service is resumed...

not clever in muddy conditions. If you're going to ride full suspension
in competition in Britain, /light/ is important if you want to do OK,
and /simple/ is important if you want to keep your maintenance bills
down.

Quoted message said:

The Marin appears lighter and better specced with XT
throughout and Hope brakes, but it does require a manual lockout on the
rear suspension. The Epic has the 'brain' (does this work as well as
the PR claims???), but lesser spec i.e. LX for most parts.

Manual lockout is not an alternative to a stable platform valve; the
Mount Vision has both, the Epic doesn't.

Quoted message said:

Can any of you share thoughts, experiences on either of these bikes
please?

The Epic's OK if you're a really big, heavy guy. It's a strong bike. But
it's burly, over-complicated, and hangs its most expensive components
out in the mud. For normal sized people I would have thought the Mount
Vision was a better bet, but it's still too complicated. And neither of
these are going to be competitive with the whippet hard-tails unless
you're very fit and strong.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
;; Drivers in the UK kill more people every single year than
;; Al Qaeda have ever killed in any single year.

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

Hi group,

I'm thinking of upgrading my MTB and finally retiring my Rigid '93
Marin Bear Valley SE which I rebuilt with full XTR in 1995. I've
accepted that full-suspension is the order of the day and that I want
something that will soak up the downhills with abundence and with
decent braking performance (i.e. hydraulic discs). I also fancy doing
some XC racing, so need a bike that is relatively lightweight and where
the suspension does not impact on climbing performance.

Based on this, I'm between an '06 Marin Mount Vision and an '06
Specialized Epic. The Marin appears lighter and better specced with XT
throughout and Hope brakes, but it does require a manual lockout on the
rear suspension. The Epic has the 'brain' (does this work as well as
the PR claims???), but lesser spec i.e. LX for most parts.

Can any of you share thoughts, experiences on either of these bikes
please?

I also have the mount vision pro at the back of my mind, but it seems
that the cost step is a big one.

A mate of mine has one of the TARA Marins. Not sure which model, comes with
fox floats and a fox platform damped shock. Just trundling along, it feels
like you're riding in a Jag on fairly smooth singletrack. Stand up to pedal
and the whole thing starts going up and down. I wouldn't want one for XC
racing. I'd go manual lockout or hardtail...

Quoted message said:

I also have the mount vision pro at the back of my mind, but it seems
that the cost step is a big one.

I've ridden Marin for some years now and can't see the logic of the MV Pro.
All the bikes have the same frame (unless Marin have changed for 2006) and
you can buy an East Peak and a lot of very good bits for far less than the
cost of a MV Pro. I bought a 2005 East Peak, sold most of the bits that go
up and down and round and round on ebay and fitted XT throughout. The only
second hand bits I used were my one year old MX forks and my saddle. The
bike cost a lot less to build than a MV Pro cost to buy.

I don't know if it's any good to race but it is a good XC bike.

John