Magellan Explorist GPS

On Mon, 11 Jun 2007 22:05:33 -0000, Duncan Smith <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

An OS map display would be nice, esp. for MTB, or more so for fell
walking. I wonder when the GPS manufacturers will get round to
sorting out their displays to handle it, I have to say I'm surprised
it hasn't happened yet.

Regards,

Duncan.

It has, I've got one of these and it's excellent:

http://www.memory-map.co.uk/road_angel_adventurer_satnav.htm

I'd already got Memory-Map so bought the cheaper Navigator 7000 (Halfords were
doing a good deal) which is the same as the Adventurer but without the bundled
OS maps.

Full UK coverage of OS 1:50K & 1:25K maps, you just buy what you need.

The included Road Angel car nav stuff is a bit bobbins compared to the likes of
Tom-Tom but I only use the unit to run Memory-Map. Internal rechargeable battery
give about 5 hours continuous use (with screen saver on), will take external
power, thinking of using a larger bottle rack mounted battery. Screen can be
hard to read in bright sunlight but it's OK. The bike bracket Memory-Map sell
will only fit narrow bars, I made my own up from the car bracket bits.

Did a 85 mile ride from Manchester to Newton-Regis in Staffordshire the other
weekend using it to navigate and all worked fine. Recorded a nice track to pour
over in great detail later 🙂

Cheers

Neil

Danny Colyer said:

Do you have a Venture Cx? Does it give OS co-ordinates? None of the
Garmin specs mention co-ordinate formats, though my reading around
suggests that most of them are able to display OS.

I think anything you can get today will let you do a number of grid
systems. Even the most basicest Garmins have OS GB as one of the
available formats, and you can switch to other grids for international use.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

Danny Colyer said:

Roger Merriman said:

you can run a basic satnav on phones, i use it in the car. get a phone
with GPS built in and a phone holder on the bike?

should be a fair bit cheaper than the GPS

I looked into it, but I don't really want a new phone and, if I want a
phone with the same features that I'm looking for in a GPS, it's likely
to work out more expensive. But thanks.

Apparently Tomtom were thinking of making a cycle specific satnav
device. Unfortunately they couldn't find enough memory to hold
instructions such as:

"In 3 metres fork left onto the cycle path"
"In 37.5 centimetres swerve right around the tree"
"In 24 centimetres rejoin the main carriageway"
"In 1.5 metres cross to the other side of the carriageway and join the
cycle path".
"In 200 metres fork right on to NCN35 for a 5 mile detour around the A457"
"In 5 miles rejoin the carriageway 200 metres from the last
instruction". "This deviation has been for your own comfort and
convenience".

They were of course also worried about litigation arising from stupid
people riding into illegally parked cars, because "the satnav told me to
do it".

Tony Raven said:

Duncan Smith wrote on 11/06/2007 23:05 +0100:

Quoted message said:

You'd get a good display of a proper OS map with a smart-phone or
pocket-pc too, which I haven't seen yet on any of the Garmin/Magellan
dedicated devices, but the snag is (and it's quite a big one) that the
battery life would be very limited in comparison, maybe only 4 hours
or so (unless things have changed in the last year or so) - and when
it goes that's your life-line gone (though I suppose you could always
carry a spare).

Depends whether you want to have it running all the time. I just use
the phone for spot checks along the way in which case it only needs to
connect up when you look at it. You can leave the GPS unit running
because they generally have 15-20 hr battery life and rechargeable
batteries. As long as the GPS is running you don't have any acquisition
time delay.

i use the phone as sat nav, lasts as long as your likely to drive and
cycle. from fully charged it's never died. even on long slow journeys.

roger

in message <[email hidden]>, Danny

Colyer (') said:

Following a recent ride where I became trapped after dark in a maze of
country lanes and took over 2 hours to find my way out, SWMBO has
informed me that I'm getting a GPS unit for my birthday whether I want
one or not.

HP iPAQ 6515, here:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/B000ALAJWI/thewebenginee-21

No, I'm serious. Yes, it's a phone. Yes it's a camera. Yes, it's got a
wordprocessor and a spreadsheet and a web browser and your diary and your
todo-list and...

And a GPS with Tom Tom route planning software.

Two taps on the screen and it will plan you a route from wherever you are
to your home. And it will give you directions in clear, spoken language
which you can hear even if it's in your back pocket.

The point is, when you're out cycling, you often need a phone. You often
need a GPS. You often want a camera. You may need your diary. This gives
you all of those in one box the size of a packet of cigarettes and
weighing 165 grammes (almost exactly the same weight as the Magellan).
Also, it's more expensive than the Magellan, but it isn't more expensive
than the Magellan and a camera and a phone.

The only downside is you only get one 'map' for free, and their maps are
only about 100 miles square. You can have several other maps, but they
cost about a fiver each.

The free software doesn't plan for bicycles, and so will route you onto
main roads - this doesn't worry me too much because I live in an area
without any really dangerous roads, but I can't find an 'avoid motorways'
option, which is a shame. You can buy an upgrade which apparently does do
routing for bicycles, but that costs £87 (including maps for the whole of
Europe) and I haven't bought it.

Oh, and if you use the GPS the battery only lasts about four hours, so it's
a 'get you home' option, not an 'all day; option.

Quoted message said:

My top priority is that it should display my location using OS
co-ordinates, as I'll always be using it in conjunction with a paper OS
map.

No, it won't do that. But as it will show you your position on a map this
is not so important.

Quoted message said:

The facility to program a route in advance and have the unit alert me
when I need to make a turning would be useful. Any connection to my
computer must be via USB, as I CBA to rummage round the back of my desk
to find a serial port every time I want to use it.

Yes, plan in advance; yes, it alerts you (by clear voice instructions) at
every junction; yes, USB connection (but you don't need it).

Quoted message said:

Basic mapping would be nice, but I don't want an expensive unit and nor
do I want to have to spend extra on maps for it.

High quality mapping (but no contours - they're Dutch).

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; in faecibus sapiens rheum propagabit

Peter Clinch said:

Danny Colyer said:

Do you have a Venture Cx? Does it give OS co-ordinates? None of the
Garmin specs mention co-ordinate formats, though my reading around
suggests that most of them are able to display OS.

I think anything you can get today will let you do a number of grid
systems. Even the most basicest Garmins have OS GB as one of the
available formats, and you can switch to other grids for international use.

Not necessarily true. Some specialised PDA, jogging, cycling or driving
reeceivers have no choice in datums, although most handhelds have over
100 to choose from. Check before buying!

In article said:

in message <[email hidden]>, Danny

Colyer (') said:

Following a recent ride where I became trapped after dark in a maze of
country lanes and took over 2 hours to find my way out, SWMBO has
informed me that I'm getting a GPS unit for my birthday whether I want
one or not.

HP iPAQ 6515, here:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/B000ALAJWI/thewebenginee-21

No, I'm serious. Yes, it's a phone. Yes it's a camera. Yes, it's got a
wordprocessor and a spreadsheet and a web browser and your diary and your
todo-list and...

And a GPS with Tom Tom route planning software.

I have a PDA with GPS (Navman PiN 570, which cost less than half what the
iPAQ does but doesn't have a phone or camera), but while I've used it for
fun a few times on my bike, the battery life isn't really up to a lot,
and using the touch screen through a waterproof case isn't very easy.
Since I didn't really buy mine for use on the bike, that isn't really a
problem, but if I was buying something for the bike, I think a Garmin
or Magellan on a handlebar mount would be more suitable.
The map is nice though (I have MemoryMap as well as the car oriented
system it came with).

Quoted message said:

Oh, and if you use the GPS the battery only lasts about four hours, so it's
a 'get you home' option, not an 'all day; option.

I can only get four hours out of mine with the screen turned off almost
all the time, which is okay for logging, but limited use for navigation.

Simon Brooke wrote on 12/06/2007 10:52 +0100:

Quoted message said:

in message <[email hidden]>, Danny

Colyer (') said:

Following a recent ride where I became trapped after dark in a maze of
country lanes and took over 2 hours to find my way out, SWMBO has
informed me that I'm getting a GPS unit for my birthday whether I want
one or not.

HP iPAQ 6515, here:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/B000ALAJWI/thewebenginee-21

Another one to look at is Palm UK are doing an offer at the moment of
free GPS and TomTom maps with a Treo 750 - which is a very nice phone
despite having WindowsMobile instead of the much better Palm OS.

--
Tony

"The most savage controversies are those about matters as to which there
is no good evidence either way."
- Bertrand Russell

"rothers" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Mon, 11 Jun 2007 22:05:33 -0000, Duncan Smith
<[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

An OS map display would be nice, esp. for MTB, or more so for fell
walking. I wonder when the GPS manufacturers will get round to
sorting out their displays to handle it, I have to say I'm surprised
it hasn't happened yet.

Regards,

Duncan.

It has, I've got one of these and it's excellent:

http://www.memory-map.co.uk/road_angel_adventurer_satnav.htm

I'd already got Memory-Map so bought the cheaper Navigator 7000 (Halfords
were
doing a good deal) which is the same as the Adventurer but without the
bundled
OS maps.

Full UK coverage of OS 1:50K & 1:25K maps, you just buy what you need.

The included Road Angel car nav stuff is a bit bobbins compared to the
likes of
Tom-Tom but I only use the unit to run Memory-Map. Internal rechargeable
battery
give about 5 hours continuous use (with screen saver on), will take
external
power, thinking of using a larger bottle rack mounted battery. Screen can
be
hard to read in bright sunlight but it's OK. The bike bracket Memory-Map
sell
will only fit narrow bars, I made my own up from the car bracket bits.

Did a 85 mile ride from Manchester to Newton-Regis in Staffordshire the
other
weekend using it to navigate and all worked fine. Recorded a nice track to
pour
over in great detail later 🙂

Cheers

Another one that is just about to be launched onto the market is
www.satmap.com - in my opinion it is good as it is waterproof and has built
in reciever. I'm not sure how long it will run for, but with a RRP of £300
it is expensive considering that it runs it's own version of OS Maps that
you buy seperately at a similar cost to Memory Map and Anquet BUT you need a
separate programme to plan route on your PC or view the ones you have just
done.

If only you could get a waterproof PDA without having to buy one of those
numb sized Otter Boxes.

So have to agree that at the moment the Road Angel 7000 seems to be a good
bet.

Dave

Simon Brooke suggested:

Quoted message said:

HP iPAQ 6515, here:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/B000ALAJWI/thewebenginee-21

No, I'm serious. Yes, it's a phone. Yes it's a camera. Yes, it's got a
wordprocessor and a spreadsheet and a web browser and your diary and your
todo-list and...

And a GPS with Tom Tom route planning software.

And *much* more than I want to spend. Thanks for the suggestion, but
it's not really what I want.

I discussed the PDA/phone/GPS option last week with a friend who has
one. He was aware of a contract where I could get the same device that
he has, with Tom Tom, for £50. The contract was £30pcm, which is more
than I spend on topping up my phone in a year. As nice as it would be
to have, it's not really worth it, IMO. And I wouldn't be satisfied
with the battery life.

Quoted message said:

Oh, and if you use the GPS the battery only lasts about four hours, so it's
a 'get you home' option, not an 'all day; option.

If I use a GPS for cycling then I want something that I can use all day.

I've had quite a detailed and informative e-mail from Nigel Cliffe about
the Garmins, thanks Nigel.

When I was looking at the Garmins originally I fell into the trap of
looking at each model and thinking: "This looks good, but the next model
up has this feature that looks rather nice". I've now gone back to last
week's shortlist, looked in more detail at each of the Garmins and
decided that beyond the Venture Cx the extra cost isn't justified by the
extra features. So I now have a shortlist of 2 models, the Magellan
Explorist 210 and the Gamine Venture Cx.

I'm assuming that the basemaps will be fairly similar for both.

The Magellan is £130 from globalpositioningsystems.co.uk, has a
monochrome display, a quoted battery life of 18 hours, features a
digital compass and is supposedly accurate to 7m.

The Garmin is £160, has a slightly larger 256 colour display, a quoted
battery life of 32 hours, doesn't have a digital compass and is
supposedly accurate to 15m.

I've read that if I want to load additional map data then the Garmin
will be restricted to Garmin maps, I believe the Magellan is less
restricted.

I like the idea of the compass on the Magellan, and the greater battery
life of the Garmin. Aesthetically I prefer the look of the Magellan,
but that's hardly relevant. It looks as though the Magellan can store
more waypoints.

I've downloaded the user manuals for both, I'm going to have a look
through those to help with my decision.

--
Danny Colyer <URL:http://www.colyer.plus.com/danny/>
Reply address is valid, but that on my website is checked more often
"Daddy, put that down. Daddy, put that down. Daddy, put that down.
Daddy, why did you put that down?" - Charlie Colyer, age 2

Martin Bulmer wrote (of the Explorist 210):

Quoted message said:

I've got one. It tells me where I am if I'm not sure, eg on trails (it
doesn't show the trails, only the major roads, but it give os reference, and
displays most villages).

You've reassured me that it does everything I want it to do, thanks.

Quoted message said:

Niggles - batteries only last a couple of days - I change them each day
to be on the safe side - it will lose the current track if the battery goes
while in use. Get rechargeable and carry spares.

That bit about losing the current track is well worth knowing. I always
carry two pairs of NiMH AA's anyway (spares for my camera), which means
I'll have spares for the GPS by default.

Quoted message said:

- even holding one or two tracks in memory severely
reduces the time it takes to display the current track or a stored one.

^^^^^^^
I assume you meant to write "increases". That, too, is well worth knowing.

Quoted message said:

I'm happy with it. Mind that Garmin Etrex that Matthew's posted a link to
looks like good value.

Thanks.

--
Danny Colyer <URL:http://www.colyer.plus.com/danny/>
Reply address is valid, but that on my website is checked more often
"Daddy, put that down. Daddy, put that down. Daddy, put that down.
Daddy, why did you put that down?" - Charlie Colyer, age 2

Richard Bates said:

Apparently Tomtom were thinking of making a cycle specific satnav
device. Unfortunately they couldn't find enough memory to hold
instructions such as:

<snip>

Quoted message said:

"In 37.5 centimetres swerve right around the tree"
"In 24 centimetres rejoin the main carriageway"
"In 1.5 metres cross to the other side of the carriageway and join the
cycle path".

LOL.

I don't think GPS is accurate enough for some cycle routes.

--
Danny Colyer <URL:http://www.colyer.plus.com/danny/>
Reply address is valid, but that on my website is checked more often
"Daddy, put that down. Daddy, put that down. Daddy, put that down.
Daddy, why did you put that down?" - Charlie Colyer, age 2

Matthew Haigh ?@?.? said:

I've recently bought one of these:-http://www.gpsw.co.uk/details/prod3429..html
(Garmin eTrex Legend, with full Mapsource Europe CDs, £100).

Quoted message said:

There are some irritations I've found; the routes are shown
point-to-point as the crow flies on the unit, rather than following the
road as they do on the PC. That means you can get to a junction and it
not be particularly clear which turn to take (though you can get around
this by putting additional markers in just after junctions).
There is a limit to the number of waypoints on a route in the unit, and
you aren't warned that you have exceeded this.

On my Geko which has no base maps but I'm guessing it's roughly the
same with the legend, I get much better results by uploading the route
as a saved track rather than a route of straight lines connecting
waypoints. Add any waypoints you need later. These will be along your
track but not part of it. The unit will navigate you along the track,
not from waypoint to waypoint. You have to watch the screen to notice
important waypoints coming up.

I use Toporoute or GmapPedometer or Google Earth (all free) to plot
the route as a gpx file. I use EasyGPS (freeware) to see the shape of
the route, add any waypoints and upload the gpx file to the Geko. If
there are too many trackpoints EasyGPS warns me and I then use
GPSBabel (freeware) to filter down to the 250 I'm allowed per track.
After the filtering I upload the gpx to bikely.com (free) which shows
me the exact line I will be following on the gps. It's a very good
approximation to the road with every major bend shown, and you can see
just where the filtering has shaved the odd bend.

After the ride I may upload the actual track as a project to
maps.innersource.com.

Cheap simple GPS, very light and small, no map or software costs,
excellent navigation provided you are able to plan it in advance.
Perfect for Audax rides. With no base map it's pants if you want to
plot a route while you're actually out, but it will at least show you
direction and distance to any waypoint you have plotted.

--
Dave...

Danny Colyer said:

I've had quite a detailed and informative e-mail from Nigel Cliffe
about the Garmins, thanks Nigel.

You're welcome (and I got online unexpectedly tonight).

Quoted message said:

............... So I now have a shortlist of 2
models, the Magellan Explorist 210 and the Gamine Venture Cx.

I'm assuming that the basemaps will be fairly similar for both.

The Magellan is £130 from globalpositioningsystems.co.uk, has a
monochrome display, a quoted battery life of 18 hours, features a
digital compass and is supposedly accurate to 7m.

The Garmin is £160, has a slightly larger 256 colour display, a quoted
battery life of 32 hours, doesn't have a digital compass and is
supposedly accurate to 15m.

The accuracy of both will be about the same. Better than 10m with good view
of satellites without WAAS/EGNOS correction. Good enough to track different
sides of an ordinary road.

The Garmin has a Compass based on GPS.
Check whether the Magellan is the same (I'd expect it to be).

The Garmin lacks a magnetic compass which the more expensive Vista model
has.
The magnetic works if unit is stationary, but its a heavy battery drain.
However, move 30 feet and the GPS compass can work things out.

Quoted message said:

I've read that if I want to load additional map data then the Garmin
will be restricted to Garmin maps, I believe the Magellan is less
restricted.

As I understand things, both use proprietry mapping formats. So, you get
what they choose to sell at the prices they choose to offer. I think
Magellan have a few more European topographical titles in their range than
Garmin.

Choice and price of maps might be a key deciding factor.

Garmin format has been largely cracked by reverse engineering, so public
domain stuff exists, including topographic data for the UK and much of
Europe. However, routable road maps are really beyond amateur hacking at
the moment due to time taken to construct the data.
Not sure if the same exists for Magellan, it didn't when I was deciding
between the two about a couple of years ago.

Quoted message said:

I like the idea of the compass on the Magellan,

Garmin has near identical compass screen, with up to four data fields which
can be customised to display whatever information you require (eg. distance
to next point, estimated arrival time at next, position, speed, glide slope
(or something, can't see the use on a bicycle!), or whatever)

Quoted message said:

and the greater
battery life of the Garmin. Aesthetically I prefer the look of the
Magellan, but that's hardly relevant.

Whether you can work the buttons on a bike does matter.
Both units were designed for holding in hand and working with fingers/thumbs
whilst in the hand, so on-bike use is always a bit "iffy".
Think about that aspect.

Quoted message said:

It looks as though the
Magellan can store more waypoints.

That looks to be the case. Though I've never had a problem in a couple of
years with the 500 limit of the Garmin.
My email gave hints of how to extend the waypoint total to millions by
converting to POI data as another map layer. This is easy if you are OK with
computer tools.

Quoted message said:

I've downloaded the user manuals for both, I'm going to have a look
through those to help with my decision.

Good plan.
However, I suspect both manuals don't really do both machines justice.

There is an alternative good Garmin manual available, some of it online, by
Dale Priest (no time to google the URL for you).

Overall I think the Garmin is the more capable, the display is a lot better
than B&W displays I've used. If you start adding maps to a B&W you run into
a problem distinguishing lines on the screen (is it a road, or a route you
are following?). Colour largely solves that problem.
But the Magellan will do the job, its a bit cheaper.

- Nigel

--
Nigel Cliffe,
Webmaster at http://www.2mm.org.uk/

dkahn400 said:

Matthew Haigh ?@?.? said:

I've recently bought one of these:-http://www.gpsw.co.uk/details/prod3429.html
(Garmin eTrex Legend, with full Mapsource Europe CDs, £100).

Quoted message said:

There are some irritations I've found; the routes are shown
point-to-point as the crow flies on the unit, rather than following the
road as they do on the PC. That means you can get to a junction and it
not be particularly clear which turn to take (though you can get around
this by putting additional markers in just after junctions).
There is a limit to the number of waypoints on a route in the unit, and
you aren't warned that you have exceeded this.

On my Geko which has no base maps but I'm guessing it's roughly the
same with the legend, I get much better results by uploading the route
as a saved track rather than a route of straight lines connecting
waypoints. Add any waypoints you need later. These will be along your
track but not part of it. The unit will navigate you along the track,
not from waypoint to waypoint. You have to watch the screen to notice
important waypoints coming up.

<big snip of useful stuff>

Thanks. I've played with some of the tools you mention, but am still
quite new at using this and am working out how to use it best so I'll
certainly give your method a go.
I think the main point here is that the supplied Garmin software does
the job, just not particularly well, meaning that workarounds of some
form have to be done.

Matt

We got our "family" GPS to go Geocaching <url:http://www.geocaching.com>
(kids love the high-tech treasure hunt of finding a Tupperware box of
'treasure' hidden in the woods), and settled for a Garmin GPS60. It also
does double duty on my bike, and works very well. No mapping, but it
does allow you to preload routes create on the PC (comes with a USB
cable). Because the route is only displayed as a line on the screen, if
there are a lot of roads leading from a junction it is possible to take
the wrong road, but you know within 20 yards that you're deviating from
the route. One thing we have learned from the Geocaching forums (but
fortunately not had to test ourselves yet) is that the aftercare for
Garmin units is far, far better than that from Magellan, examples of
this being out of warranty units being replaced for free, or user-
damaged units being repaired for a nominal fee.

--
Colin

Coincidence is the alibi of the Gods

(remove FOOT to reply)

Danny Colyer said:

Martin Bulmer wrote (of the Explorist 210):

Quoted message said:

- even holding one or two tracks in memory
severely reduces the time it takes to display the current track or a
stored one.

^^^^^^^
I assume you meant to write "increases". That, too, is well worth
knowing.

duh, oops.yes, slows it down
--

Martin Bulmer

Nigel Cliffe said:

Danny Colyer said:

I like the idea of the compass on the Magellan,

Garmin has near identical compass screen,

That could explain why one of the screen shots on the Garmin website
looks like a compass display, despite the specs saying it doesn't have
an electronic compass. Now that I've read the description of the
compass feature in the Magellan manual, it doesn't seem quite so great.
You have to be moving for it to give a bearing, and if I'm moving then
I should be able to work out which direction I'm heading in just by
watching which direction the arrow moves in.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

It looks as though the
Magellan can store more waypoints.

That looks to be the case. Though I've never had a problem in a couple of
years with the 500 limit of the Garmin.
My email gave hints of how to extend the waypoint total to millions by
converting to POI data as another map layer. This is easy if you are OK with
computer tools.

Great, I'll look into that further if I order the Garmin (though as you
say, 500 ought to be plenty).

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I've downloaded the user manuals for both, I'm going to have a look
through those to help with my decision.

Good plan.
However, I suspect both manuals don't really do both machines justice.

Before reading the manuals, I was leaning slightly towards the Garmin.
I've now read the Magellan manual and am satisfied that the Magellan is
an excellent choice. I just need to read the Garmin manual and decide
whether it's a better choice.

Quoted message said:

There is an alternative good Garmin manual available, some of it online, by
Dale Priest (no time to google the URL for you).

I'm sure I can find it, thanks.

--
Danny Colyer <URL:http://www.colyer.plus.com/danny/>
Reply address is valid, but that on my website is checked more often
"Daddy, put that down. Daddy, put that down. Daddy, put that down.
Daddy, why did you put that down?" - Charlie Colyer, age 2

Danny Colyer said:

That could explain why one of the screen shots on the Garmin website
looks like a compass display, despite the specs saying it doesn't have
an electronic compass. Now that I've read the description of the
compass feature in the Magellan manual, it doesn't seem quite so great.
You have to be moving for it to give a bearing, and if I'm moving then
I should be able to work out which direction I'm heading in just by
watching which direction the arrow moves in.

Any gps can simulate a compass when it's moving. This implies that the
Magellan unit you're interested in does not have an independent
electronic compass. This is not necessarily a bad thing. I nearly
always run my Geko with the compass turned off to save the batteries;
it's an extra drain. If you're moving you don't need it as the gps
itself provides full compass function, and if you're following a route
or track you don't need it.

Quoted message said:

Before reading the manuals, I was leaning slightly towards the Garmin.
I've now read the Magellan manual and am satisfied that the Magellan is
an excellent choice. I just need to read the Garmin manual and decide
whether it's a better choice.

The manual for the Garmin Geko 301 doesn't give much away. It doesn't
even tell you how to do a factory reset which you might need if the
software starts behaving oddly. You can learn far more about specific
units from googling the gps newsgroups.

--
Dave...

I said:

Before reading the manuals, I was leaning slightly towards the Garmin.
I've now read the Magellan manual and am satisfied that the Magellan is
an excellent choice. I just need to read the Garmin manual and decide
whether it's a better choice.

By the time I went to bed last night, I'd decided to order the Garmin
Venture Cx.

I'd also determined (or so I thought) that the only difference between
the Venture Cx and the Legend Cx (the next model up), apart from the
colour, is that the Legend Cx comes with a USB cable and SD card, the
Venture Cx doesn't.

I thought there had to be more to it than that, so I checked again what
comes in the box and noticed that the Legend Cx comes with Garmin's
Mapsource Trip & Waypoint Manager software, the Venture Cx doesn't. The
difference in price is about the same as the cost of buying the software
separately. Is it likely to be worth buying the Legend Cx just to get
the software, or are there (as I suspect) alternative ways of doing the
same things?

Before anyone suggests that I buy the Venture Cx, then get the software
separately if I decide later that I want it, I prefer the colour of the
Legend Cx. That's the best reason I have for deciding before I order
the GPS whether I want the software.

--
Danny Colyer <URL:http://www.colyer.plus.com/danny/>
Reply address is valid, but that on my website is checked more often
"Daddy, put that down. Daddy, put that down. Daddy, put that down.
Daddy, why did you put that down?" - Charlie Colyer, age 2