loose spider/chainrings

Keiron Kinninmont said:

hey all.

my spider is loose. how do i tighten it? i expected to just have to use a allen key but the bolts
holding the spider to the chainrings have round holes not hexagonal ones. clearly i don't have a
clue what i'm doing, any ideas, what tool do i need? it's an old and bottom range crank and
chainrings, AceraX and hyperdrive, just in case that makes a difference.

cheers

Sounds like the rings are riveted to the spider. Nothing you can do to tighten them short of a
hammer and punch. Likely just to come loose again in a short time.

G

GregR <[email hidden]> spoke thusly...

Quoted message said:

Keiron Kinninmont said:

hey all.

my spider is loose. how do i tighten it? i expected to just have to use a allen key but the bolts
holding the spider to the chainrings have round holes not hexagonal ones. clearly i don't have a
clue what i'm doing, any ideas, what tool do i need? it's an old and bottom range crank and
chainrings, AceraX and hyperdrive, just in case that makes a difference.

cheers

Sounds like the rings are riveted to the spider. Nothing you can do to tighten them short of a
hammer and punch. Likely just to come loose again in a short time.

G

Question: are riveted rings and spiders the same as the bolt on ones?

I ask because, what about drilling out the rivets and installing ring bolts? it would seem to me
like a good way to go (if the spider and rings are compatible with bolts) because then when the
rings are toast, you only need to get some new ones.

If the holes are too small for the bolts after the rivets are drilled out, and providing there is
enough material, you can always drill the rings and spider holes to fit the ring bolts. Important
note, this must be done in a cool drill manner. IOW, make sure the drill bit is good and sharp, is
a metal bit (can drill metal, not meaning the bit is metal, although that is a help;-), is
installed in a drill press (for solid alignment and pressure), and make sure to use machining oil
(3-in-1, or motor oil will work in a pinch). if the bit heats up, it will distemper the spider and
or rings. it would be a good idea to drill the rings and spider as one in case you don't get the
alignment centered exactly. but this option is only a good one if you are good at machining metal
(ie, know what your doing fairly well), and you have money to buy a new crank and rings should you
kill these ones.
--
~Travis

megalink.net~farmersOpen ↗

yeah, so i heard 🙁 cheers tho.

"Technician" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

GregR <[email hidden]> spoke thusly...

Quoted message said:

Keiron Kinninmont said:

hey all.

my spider is loose. how do i tighten it? i expected to just have to use

a

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

allen key but the bolts holding the spider to the chainrings have round holes not hexagonal
ones. clearly i don't have a clue what i'm doing,

any

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

ideas, what tool do i need? it's an old and bottom range crank and chainrings, AceraX and
hyperdrive, just in case that makes a

difference.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

cheers

Sounds like the rings are riveted to the spider. Nothing you can do to tighten them short of a
hammer and punch. Likely just to come loose again in a short time.

G

Question: are riveted rings and spiders the same as the bolt on ones?

I ask because, what about drilling out the rivets and installing ring bolts? it would seem to me
like a good way to go (if the spider and rings are compatible with bolts) because then when the
rings are toast, you only need to get some new ones.

If the holes are too small for the bolts after the rivets are drilled out, and providing there is
enough material, you can always drill the rings and spider holes to fit the ring bolts. Important
note, this must be done in a cool drill manner. IOW, make sure the drill bit is good and sharp, is
a metal bit (can drill metal, not meaning the bit is metal, although that is a help;-), is
installed in a drill press (for solid alignment and pressure), and make sure to use machining oil
(3-in-1, or motor oil will work in a pinch). if the bit heats up, it will distemper the spider and
or rings. it would be a good idea to drill the rings and spider as one in case you don't get the
alignment centered exactly. but this option is only a good one if you are good at machining metal
(ie, know what your doing fairly well), and you have money to buy a new crank and rings should you
kill these ones.
--
~Travis

megalink.net~farmersOpen ↗

"Keiron Kinninmont" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

yeah, so i heard 🙁 cheers tho.

"Technician" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

GregR <[email hidden]> spoke thusly...

Quoted message said:

On Fri, 27 Jun 2003 16:45:56 +0100, "Keiron Kinninmont" <[email hidden]> wrote:

>hey all.
>
>my spider is loose. how do i tighten it? i expected to just have to use

a

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>allen key but the bolts holding the spider to the chainrings have round holes not hexagonal
>ones. clearly i don't have a clue what i'm doing,

any

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>ideas, what tool do i need? it's an old and bottom range crank and chainrings, AceraX and
>hyperdrive, just in case that makes a

difference.

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Quoted message said:

>
>cheers

<snip>

(Un)fortunately, my reader doesn't thread "travis'" ramblings directly, so I generally am not
bothered by them. I am starting to think that it is simple stupidity that makes him blather on about
things ... my appologies to those who actually take time to read this rant.

An now for a "Travis Rant."

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Quoted message said:

Question: are riveted rings and spiders the same as the bolt on ones?

Nice to see that you start out by showing that you know nothing about the topic.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I ask because, what about drilling out the rivets and installing ring bolts? it would seem to me
like a good way to go (if the spider and rings are compatible with bolts) because then when the
rings are toast, you only need to get some new ones.

And we are off to the races.

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Quoted message said:

If the holes are too small for the bolts after the rivets are drilled out, and providing there
is enough material, you can always drill the rings and spider holes to fit the ring bolts.

And he is supposed to counter sink the ring how? You have noticed, in your career as a machinist and
mechanic, that most if not all chainrings are counter sunk ... correct ... and, of course, you know
why the nut/bolt/chainring interface is designed this way.

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Important note, this must be done in a cool drill manner. IOW, make sure the drill bit is good
and sharp, is a metal bit (can drill metal, not meaning the bit is metal,

So tell us Machinist Mate how does one tell what material a drill is intended for, and once you have
acquired a “metal bit” how do you tell that it is sharp?

You provide the caveat, and then provide no information for the determination. I would suppose you
provide no reall information, because you have no knowledge of the topic at hand.

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although that is a help;-), is installed in a drill press (for solid alignment and pressure),

Try an overhead mill with an indexing head.

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and make sure to use machining oil (3-in-1, or motor oil will work in a pinch).

By “machining oil” I suppose you mean (high-sulphur) cutting oil (which is different
from machinist’s oil). BTW ... just a note from the “Machinist Handbook” “
... motor oil will not do in a pinch,” and from the Sutherland’s manual (since this is
bicycle related) “Motor oil, bicycle oil (3-in-1), WD 40, or yesterday’s coffee will not
do in a pinch.”

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if the bit heats up, it will distemper the spider and or rings.

Does the metal get a hacking cough and runny nose with that distemper?

I suppose the word you were looking for was “anneal” or “annealing,” the
process of softening metal by heating. Of course to fully anneal a steal ring, you would have to
heat the entire ring to close to melting point, and then slowly cool it. Do you actually believe you
can generate that kind of heat just from drilling out the rivets, and enlarging the holes, without
cutting fluid?

Rather than “distempering” (annealing) the metal, drilling without cutting fluid will
quickly dull the drill and overheat the work, and the friction will actually cause work hardening
of the hole.

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it would be a good idea to drill the rings and spider as one in case you don't get the alignment
centered exactly. but this option is only a good one if you are good at machining metal (ie,
know what your doing fairly well),

It is so kind of you to give information about a topic that you so obviously know nothing about, and
then give the caveat that the person doing the work should “ know what your doing fairly
well.”

How about knowing something about the topic that you are responding to, before you go out and post
drivel that is worse than useless. I say worse than useless, since someone who does not frequent
this group might take your mindless blather as a statement of fact.

If you are so interested in machine tool practices, why don’t you enroll at a vocational
school or a junior college somewhere ... god knows it won’t interfere with your busy work
schedule. If you don’t have the cash for a proper school, you could always get the government
to foot the training bill ... all you have to do is sign away a couple of years of your meaningless
life. Of course it will be a while in your training before you get to heat treating, work hardening,
case hardening, annealing, and so on. First, they have to teach you how to properly turn on a bench
grinder (something that I doubt you know).

R