Integrated Bar/Stem

[rplace13]

I am seriously considering an integrated Bar/Stem. I love my current ControlTech Carbon Comp bars but my FSA stem sucks and simply will not keep the bars from rotating. My CT bars are now "dented" but not cracked where they attach to the stem and I am sick to my stomach over it I am getting scared to ride on them. Bummer!

Anyone got any thoughts on the higher end brands like Most, Cinelli, Deda versus the more reasonably pirced Trigon, Token, no-names? Seems like they are all made in Taiwan and most likely made by the same company or two to the sellers specs.

Any reason to pay 500-800 hundred when I can get a set for 300 or less?

 

[Tech72]

I currently use the FSA Force stem and K-Wing bar combo and don't have a problem. The bars are secure and don't rotate. Have you tried torquing the bar clamp screws to spec?

Regarding an integrated stem/bar, prior to the current setup, I used the integrated Cinelli Integralter aluminum stem/bar then went to the integrated Deda Alanera al/carbon stem/bar. They both were very stiff but and looked great on the bike but ultimately didn't fit me well. I couldn't adjust the bar angle to fit me. So before you decide on spending $500+ on an integrated stem/bar, make sure the bar angle fits your position.

I've only used the Integralter and Alanera, so don't know about the other brand names and no-names. I'm sure they're decent quality though.

 

[alienator]

Bar/stem combos: one orientation must fit all, which means a lot of people would have to compromise fit to use said combo. Going the custom route at least allows you to get the bars positioned in a way that fits you.

As for your current situation, that sucks, but it does sound like your bars are trashed. In the future you should buy assembly paste for CF. Assembly paste has microspheres in it that allow you to run a lower torque on bolts or to have a more secure compression hold at the same torque. Any bike store worth anything should have said paste. It doesn't cost much, and just a little bit of it lasts forever.

Last, before you go blaming FSA and their stem, consider that there are a lot of degrees of freedom in the production and finishing of CF parts, so it's just as likely....maybe more.....that the bar's clamp area was a tad small in diameter.

 

[rplace13]

Thanks for the replies. I do have a torque wrench and did torque them to specs. My Easton EC-70 stem worked great with the CT bars, but the stem was too short for my set up. I got the FSA in a moment of desperation because I could get the length I needed and get it fast. From the get go the FSA front plate was way closer to the main stem (very little gap) then any other stem on any other bar I have seen. I even put other bars in the FSA stem thinking my ContolTech bar might be on the small side...not the case. While I might not be 100% correct, I can only conclude that in my case the issue is with the stem not the bars.

For the money and what I have seen I am just not impressed with FSA, but that is just my opinion. The plasma bars are way overpriced IMHO compared to others out there.

I'll have to look into the paste - thanks!

 

[Bigbananabike]

I'd never get integrated stem/bars.
I just think of one word (ok, $ too!) - CRASH = they're ruined.
Try another stem or stem and bars = a much better solution.

BBB ;-)

 

[rplace13]

Carbon fiber and crashing seems to be a major fear in the cycling community. Why is that so? How many times do you all crash, daily? Back when I raced I was involved in crashes about once a month. They hurt but rarely was my bike damaged. Now that I just ride fast and hard with friends, clubs or by myself I rarely put the bike down...like zero times in the past three years.

I was in such a bad crash once that my ribs were separated, I bruised my liver and at the hospital they were talking about removing my spleen due to internal bleeding. I was riding a CF bike at the time and still ride it today. The bike was fine. I did need a new helmet....BTW, it was not CF

I'm guessing all this CF damage fear is pure speculation. Anyone actually have a typical road rash inducing crash that does not threaten life or limb and have a carbon component fail?

I guess I am of the mind set to buy things I want for the performance I expect to get regardless of what the future might bring. If I was crashing so often that it was causing me to buy parts more frequently then simply wanting to buy them, I think I'd find another sport. It would be my body/skin that could not take it over my wallet.

 

[alienator]

Carbon fiber and crashing seems to be a major fear in the cycling community. Why is that so?

I think you've hinted around at the answer. People have a fear, in general, that outweighs the actual risk. As is almost always the case, perceived risk is much greater than actual risk. With that in mind, CF can be compromised with certain types of impacts, but so can metals....like aluminum. Alloy bars have been known to fail quite dramatically as a result of a crash. Moreover, alloy can corrode and fail from prolonged contact with sweat or other salt solutions.

If you're looking for a performance benefit of any tangible sort, you won't find it with a bar/stem combo. That much is certain. Bar/stem combos can also limit the range of adjustibility that you might need. Early in the riding season (if you live in a place that has seasonal riding, uhm, seasons) when you're not as flexible, a bar/stem combo could be problematic.

 

[rplace13]

I am not looking for a performance gain if you are talking weight. First an integrated bar typically can be more then other separate stems and bars. Second if I want true weight savings I'll lose some weight . Pounds lost is way better then grams lost.

A couple of times my bars rotating has scared me so much that I now want to get rid of that possibility altogether. Sort of related to my not crashing post above. I am too old to start crashing again. My bars rotating forward when I am going 35+mph does not make me want to ride more. So with a messed up set of bars and the stem looking like the problem, I am going to get both anyway. I figured I'd give integrated a try and see how that works.

The intent of my post was not to debate a stem bar over an integrated...I am getting an integrated. I just thought I would see if there was any real world experience (not guesses) with some of the lesser know brands. My gut tells me that a sub $300 Token will do the job for the average Joe just as well as an $800 FSA Plasma, which I would not buy even if they were giving them away....now the MOst or Deda I think are pretty sharp...but still pretty high on the $$$ side.

Hell, it's only money right?

 

[alienator]

A Token bar/stem will work just fine. Token makes, or rather has made for it quality products. My only experience was with a Ruegamer bar/stem combo that was made for me. I liked it quite a bit. There was some beautiful CF layup done on it.

 

[alfeng]

A couple of times my bars rotating has scared me so much that I now want to get rid of that possibility altogether. Sort of related to my not crashing post above. I am too old to start crashing again. My bars rotating forward when I am going 35+mph does not make me want to ride more. So with a messed up set of bars and the stem looking like the problem, I am going to get both anyway. I figured I'd give integrated a try and see how that works.

The intent of my post was not to debate a stem bar over an integrated...I am getting an integrated. I just thought I would see if there was any real world experience (not guesses) with some of the lesser know brands. My gut tells me that a sub $300 Token will do the job for the average Joe just as well as an $800 FSA Plasma, which I would not buy even if they were giving them away....now the MOst or Deda I think are pretty sharp...but still pretty high on the $$$ side.

Hell, it's only money right?

As I understand what you've said, the only problem you are experiencing is that the bars rotate in the stem ... not that it isn't a serious problem!

While you are assessing integrated handlebars, because you really can't do anything else with your bars which you described as being "dented" but otherwise not damaged, why don't you just use some JB WELD (~$5.00 ... accept NO SUBSTITUTES!) to permanently bond (MISTAKES will become PERMANENT; so, if you go this route, be certain the bars are centered & the angle is what you want.) the stem & handlebar together as a DIY integrated bar/stem project? I suppose you could get by with only bonding the face plate to the handlebar ...

Or, if that seems too drastic, just cover the part of the bar that extends beyond the stem with masking tape ... remove the bar from the stem & "clean"/prep the center section, and then lay up a thin layer of JB WELD on the center section to increase its outer diameter.

You can, of course, probably cut a small shim(s) from a soda can which should add enough thickness to keep the handlebars from rotating ... "coin" the edges & remove the anodized surfaces from the shim(s) with some emery cloth ...

 

[rplace13]

alfeng, interesting idea on the JB Weld. I just might have to give that a try.

Actually I had taken the stem apart and at first just roughed up the stem and face plate surface where it contacts the bars with sand paper. No joy. Next I took a file and made tiny ridges in it sort of like a coin as you called it. Again, no luck. I went to two different bike shops looking for a shim to put around the bars, neither had them in stock. The one shop suggested using a soda can to create shims. I made one then two and still it did not work. It was at this point I decided to ditch the FSA stem and look into the ControlTech mono-comp bar/stem integrated but the cost was just too great. However I really love the control tech bars, really nice set up.

To update a bit the bars are now more then dented they have a horizontal crack running the width of the stem clamping area.