How many of you carry a gun as part of your cycling equipment?

[cheapie]

until we can keep guns out of the hands of criminals, we shouldn't try to keep them out of law-abiding citizens.

 

[SF_Vitus]

This is a fine example of intellectual American discourse....."and the guy...sucks." Wow.

For those from foreign lands, we, here in America, prefer not to use common sense when dealing with people or animals. We prefer to shoot first and think..well....maybe not even think. Of course, there's no use arguing with us: we're right 'cuz we're Americans. And if that doesn't convince you, then you better remember that we're a bona fide super power. We've got all sorts of weapons, and if you keep up with your anti-'merican stuff, we just might invade you....us and our coalition....Eritrea.....

Did the other yahoo ever point out exactly what all the lies were in "Bowling for Columbine?" Prolly not. Prolly needed to set the tripwire before he went to bed.

What a strange discussion. It never occured to me to carry a gun while riding through Golden Gate Park. I guess the herd of buffalo that live there are more dangerous than I thought. If someone is going to steal your bike, is it worth killing them? These are sad times we live in when the value of a bike is worth more than the value of a human life.

Here's a concept: Securing America through armed cycling.

 

[cheapie]

i don't think it's a matter of killing someone to keep your bike. imho, most people who carry guns do so to keep from getting killed, not just robbed.

 

[boudreaux]

Some of us in the U.S. even take the view that having everyone armed is not the solution to gun violence but rather the cause.

Take a look at gun crime in Switzerland, where I think every able bodied male is trained in markmanship and required to have a rifle. Disarmanent of law abiding citizens doesn't have alot of impact on crime and violence unless you also come up with a suitable program for getting rid of the bad guys.

 

[portrider]

I live in Pittsburgh, PA in a "bad area". My "'hood" has gone downhill in the past 10 years. Drugs, prostitution, shootings, crime in general are way up. I've always been into the shooting sports and was of the attitude that anyone carrying a gun was paranoid. I was leaving the local watering hole one evening when right outside three young men were breaking into a car. They saw me and asked if it was my car. I said no. Their answer to me was to mind my own MFing business. With that I called the police on my cell phone. That's when one of them stuck his hand inside his coat and said "want to see what I got?" After that I almost always carry a gun, but haven't carried on the bike yet. The thought has crossed my mind.

Dan

 

[capwater]

Take a look at gun crime in Switzerland, where I think every able bodied male is trained in markmanship and required to have a rifle. Disarmanent of law abiding citizens doesn't have alot of impact on crime and violence unless you also come up with a suitable program for getting rid of the bad guys.

BINGO! Guns in the hands of LAW ABIDING citizens is not the problem, but when the super predator cretins get then, that's another issue. In rural America where gun owbership is significantly higher, crime is much lower than in major metropolitan areas. Sorry for the preaching. Being a Life Member of the NRA, this is more than just a passing topic of interest to me.

Cheers, go out and ride!

 

[Jschenk]

Take a look at gun crime in Switzerland, where I think every able bodied male is trained in markmanship and required to have a rifle. Disarmanent of law abiding citizens doesn't have alot of impact on crime and violence unless you also come up with a suitable program for getting rid of the bad guys.

Er, yeah. Without ammo tho. And for use if there's a war.
I don't think anyone here in switzerland wears a gun when cycling (well, there may be a deer hunter without a car, I don't know...).

I'm happy we solve the problems here differently, but every country has to know what works best for it.
I don't know a lot about the US, I never was there and I don't want to judge. Peace.

 

[The Cheetah]

Are you saying that Texas is as dangerous as the west bank in Israel? Sounds like a place I wouldn't want to visit, let alone cycle there...

I didn't say anything about Israel did I? No.

 

[alienator]

alienator,

Here's the link to the distortions and lies:

http://www.bowlingfortruth.com/

I'd be happy to have an offline discussion.

Regards,

Joe West

Discuss what: the fact that your cursory research effort involved going to a .com, that makes no pretense about providing a biased on its "facts?"

Discuss what: the rapant fear you must have when you go into the backcountry? Let's see what has resulted in more deaths: bear or large cat maulings, or people incapable of handling firearms.

Discuss what: how concealed weapons make you safer? Really?

Discuss what: your paranoia, the fear which drives you to believe that someone is out to take what is yours?

Really, you offer as proof a site which starts its argument off by calling Michael Moore a "left wing" something or other? Now what critical thought is involved there. I suppose you'd be upset if someone called you a neo-nazi right wing conservative freak, wouldn't you? And calling you such would pretty much invalidate any argument said person provided.

Please: learn how to do real research and employ valid critical thought. That your unrealistic, petty fears of iminent danger drive your need to carry a gun in no way offers any proof that said gun does any good.

As for the claims that a gun is just a "tool". That is true, to a small extent, but that claim is also disingenuous. A hammer is a tool. A screwdriver is a tool. In fact, a pipe bomb is a tool. A car bomb is a tool. A daisy cutter is a tool, and a fusion bomb is a tool. Makes them all seem pretty inocuous, eh?

Allegedly we live in some great society, but it's impossible to see that when we rarely work together toward what's best for society. Comparisons to other countries or comparisons by persons from other countries are important to this discourse, because despite what xenophobes in power or special interests claim, people everywhere live under the same "threats," although some have more relative threat. Every society has elements that act out against society norms, and shockingly most of the other societies in the world (not including those at war), have fewer casualties from said anti social behavior than we do. And in those countries at war, we, the "civilized ones", are one of the greatest contributors to the death and destruction of the innocent. Now, you'll have to do more than go to a .com to discover this. You'll actually have to do valid research.

Try it.

 

[dhk]

Er, yeah. Without ammo tho. And for use if there's a war.
I don't think anyone here in switzerland wears a gun when cycling (well, there may be a deer hunter without a car, I don't know...).

I'm happy we solve the problems here differently, but every country has to know what works best for it.
I don't know a lot about the US, I never was there and I don't want to judge. Peace.

Jschenk: Would like to be clear about gun ownership in switzerland. In addition to keeping your military-issue weapon, can a citizen also buy and keep a hunting rifle at home? Is it possible for an ordinary citizen to buy and carry a handgun? How is ammunition controlled?

 

[Joe West]

Alienator,

It appears I have touched a rather sensitive issue for you. I look forward to an interesting email conversation should you decide to write.

Kind Regards,

Joe

Discuss what: the fact that your cursory research effort involved going to a .com, that makes no pretense about providing a biased on its "facts?"
<snip>

.

 

[lumpy]

The problem I'd have carrying a gun is that I might end up using it. What kind of confrontation could I possibly get into on a bike ride where I'd need to kill somebody?

 

[Joe West]

The kind of confrontation you don't expect.

The problem I'd have carrying a gun is that I might end up using it. What kind of confrontation could I possibly get into on a bike ride where I'd need to kill somebody?

 

[SF_Vitus]

Alienator-> Thanks for your words of reason and sense.

 

[Matt N]

At first I thought this thread was some kind of joke. But obviously some people seriously contemplate killing another person as they head out for their health activities. What!?

Fortunately, here in Australia, we respect other people and can go for a simple bike ride without feeling threatened by others. Funnily enough, this seems to be the consensus in EVERY country other than, of course, America.

You Yanks have created a "culture" dominated by hatred, intolerance and greed. This has resulted in a pervasive paranoia, such that you can't even engage in a leisurely activity (such as riding a bike) without the (real or apparent) danger of being attacked. Of course this has led to an uncontrollable vicious cycle of killing-defending-killing-defending...and you still wonder why you have the highest murder rate in the world.

Gee, I wonder why the rest of the world finds your culture so amusing, yet so abhorent? You get what you deserve!

Cheers

P.S. Sorry to all of the normal, decent, peace loving Americans (of which I know there are very many), but I am simply trying to reflect the impression which your gun-toting countryfolk portray to the rest of the world.

 

[alienator]

At first I thought this thread was some kind of joke. But obviously some people seriously contemplate killing another person as they head out for their health activities. What!?
P.S. Sorry to all of the normal, decent, peace loving Americans (of which I know there are very many), but I am simply trying to reflect the impression which your gun-toting countryfolk portray to the rest of the world.

Unfortunately, it seems that a great number of Americans don't give two sh_ts about what the rest of the world thinks. The funny thing is, while said Americans want to discount world opinion re: our wonderful society, we want to preach to the world how they should behave. You're either with us or against us, right? The world is that black and white, right?

We americans just love shootin' people that don't do as we tell them. On a more serious note, it would be nice if more Americans actually took the time to learn something about the rest of the world, history (as in world history, not US history), and other cultures. But that plainly won't happen, because that is unAmerican.

 

[Weisse Luft]

Concealed carry is NOT premediated murder. Its no different than one who takes a martial art...shooting is a martial art. All instructors in the self defense shooting arts stress the exact same disclipline as the physical martial arts.

World history has NOTHING to do with this discussion. There is NO country in the world with a population as culturally diverse, economically free or individualistic as the United States. And people are still literally DYING to come here.

 

[Doctor Morbius]

At first I thought this thread was some kind of joke. But obviously some people seriously contemplate killing another person as they head out for their health activities. What!?

Fortunately, here in Australia, we respect other people and can go for a simple bike ride without feeling threatened by others. Funnily enough, this seems to be the consensus in EVERY country other than, of course, America.

You Yanks have created a "culture" dominated by hatred, intolerance and greed. This has resulted in a pervasive paranoia, such that you can't even engage in a leisurely activity (such as riding a bike) without the (real or apparent) danger of being attacked. Of course this has led to an uncontrollable vicious cycle of killing-defending-killing-defending...and you still wonder why you have the highest murder rate in the world.

Gee, I wonder why the rest of the world finds your culture so amusing, yet so abhorent? You get what you deserve!

Cheers

P.S. Sorry to all of the normal, decent, peace loving Americans (of which I know there are very many), but I am simply trying to reflect the impression which your gun-toting countryfolk portray to the rest of the world.

Frankly I find your comments offensive. Most people here have not created anything of the sort of what you've described. Most people here get up and go to work and love their kids just like anywhere else. Most people here do not want to be confrontational and abhor violence just like people elsewhere.

Unfortunately, there is a criminal element here that our law enforcement and judicial system is unable to or unwilling to do anything about.

You've obviously never lived in Detroit Michigan, Gary Indiana or Atlanta Georgia. C'mon over and go for a bike ride in those cities alone and see why we feel the need to protect ourselves and our families.

Don't paint us all with the same brush to be a bunch of gun toting yahoos. We're not.

 

[alienator]

Concealed carry is NOT premediated murder. Its no different than one who takes a martial art...shooting is a martial art. All instructors in the self defense shooting arts stress the exact same disclipline as the physical martial arts.

World history has NOTHING to do with this discussion. There is NO country in the world with a population as culturally diverse, economically free or individualistic as the United States. And people are still literally DYING to come here.

Sure history has a place here: the lack of historical understanding helps to feed a lack of understanding of your own society, especially when our society is as diverse as it is. And as far as no other country being as diverse, well you plainly don't know what you're talking about and need to take a look at other countries. Canada, UK, many other countries have loads of diversity on par with the US. And as for people dying to get here, that might be so. So what? There are also people dying for us to leave them alone, and there are people dying here because of ignoramuses with guns that have no understanding of human behavior.

Isn't it about time for some NRAbot to repeat that wonderful cliche about only the criminals having guns? Surely, someone will. I mean, there are people out to get us, aren't there?

 

[alienator]

Frankly I find your comments offensive. Most Don't paint us all with the same brush to be a bunch of gun toting yahoos. We're not.

You're offended. Is that supposed to mean something to anybody? Hell, the rest of the world is offended by us, yet our society doesn't care.

Get over it. Or expend the energy to try and understand why things are the way they are. Of course, doing that might mean discovering things that aren't black and white.