First Rucksac

jacko said:

I know we don't know where Marc is taking his scouts,

T0

Quoted message said:

But when I was a VSL and on the district activities team, we would have had reservations about
the suitability of someone to lead a walk if they had to ask somebody elses' advice about
rucksacks ...

I'm not leading the hike, I know what I want in a Rucksac ( I am quite happy to buy my son one ,
I did last year) , but would be dubious about infilcing my views upon others who are spending
their own money ,I wanted a wider spread of views to present to the parents, and I would consider
anyone that :-
A) Thought that asking questions made you unsuitable to lead.
B) Had reservations about someones ability to lead based on their knowledge of the current
rucksac market

to be foolish and pedantic in the extreme.

Does that explain my reasoning to your satisfaction?

--
Marc. Please note the above address is a spam trap, use marcc to reply Printing for clubs of all
types jaceeprint.demon.co.ukjaceeprint.demon.co.ukOpen ↗ Stickers, banners & clothing, for clubs,teams, magazines
and dealers.

John Russell said:

Of course, it could be said that he should have anticipated the question from parents and did
whatever updating he wanted to do *beforehand*.

True! :-(

But it came as a bit of a shock how few had rucksacs!

--
Marc. Please note the above address is a spam trap, use marcc to reply Printing for clubs of all
types jaceeprint.demon.co.ukjaceeprint.demon.co.ukOpen ↗ Stickers, banners & clothing, for clubs,teams, magazines
and dealers.

KRO said:

Quoted message said:

We have just told the troop that they are going on a 11 mile hike with over night camp and that
they will all need a rucksac , straight afterwards parents started asking what would be a good
rucksac to buy. Suggestions?

I see you've got plenty of suggestions, but as an aside is it more difficult these days to do
these things?

To do what things?

Quoted message said:

Are there not numerous regulations etc to work through.

There are regulations , but in the main they are there to protect the YP

Quoted message said:

I enjoyed this kind of thing when I was a boy with the scouts and cadets. My boy goes to scouts
but it's all trendy now - no uniform, which I think is a shame, though I'm not sure he'd go if
he had to,

No uniform, since when?admitadly the shirt is now blue, there is no hat and the trousers are more
modernly styled, but there certainly is a uniform.

Quoted message said:

teenagers are so image conscious these days. Aren't girls allowed in the Scouts these days, which
begs the question are boys allowed in the Guides! :-)

Boys are not allowed to join Guiding UK and most leaders would frown at boys being in the Guides (
in the other meaning that I took from your msg)

--
Marc. Please note the above address is a spam trap, use marcc to reply Printing for clubs of all
types jaceeprint.demon.co.ukjaceeprint.demon.co.ukOpen ↗ Stickers, banners & clothing, for clubs,teams, magazines
and dealers.

Rifleman said:

Quoted message said:

Ha! I never used to travel that light. I typically carried 45 pounds or so.

You ARE joking, aren't you?

No.

Paul
--
wilderness-wales.co.ukwilderness-wales.co.ukOpen ↗
wildwales.fsnet.co.ukwildwales.fsnet.co.ukOpen ↗
photosig.comuserphotosOpen ↗

"marc" <marccdimspamremovedimspamto [email hidden]> wrote in
message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

We have just told the troop that they are going on a 11 mile hike with over night camp and that
they will all need a rucksac , straight afterwards parents started asking what would be a good
rucksac to buy. Suggestions?

Several years ago now I managed to get a 100 litre framed rucksack from out of the Argos catalogue.
I think it's made by "Outbound" and it does me just fine :-)

YiS

Graham
--
----
Beaver Scout Leader 16th Gosport Scout Group Website: 16thgosport.org.uk16thgosport.org.ukOpen ↗ Hero For Hire,
Legend In My Own Lunchtime

In message <[email hidden]>, KRO <[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

"marc" <marccdimspamremovedimspamto [email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

We have just told the troop that they are going on a 11 mile hike with over night camp and that
they will all need a rucksac , straight afterwards parents started asking what would be a good
rucksac to buy. Suggestions?

I see you've got plenty of suggestions, but as an aside is it more difficult these days to do these
things? Are there not numerous regulations etc to work through. I enjoyed this kind of thing when I
was a boy with the scouts and cadets. My boy goes to scouts but it's all trendy now - no uniform,
which I think is a shame, though I'm not sure he'd go if he had to, teenagers are so image
conscious these days. Aren't girls allowed in the Scouts these days, which begs the question are
boys allowed in the Guides! :-)

KRO

Reading the other posts, it seems as though things clearly aren't as 'basic' as when I had to do a
'24-hr hike' as part of the 1st Class badge many years ago ;-)

(a) Dropped off in the middle of nowhere and handed a cloth OS map and told the destination -- you
were told where you were 'approximately' and then left to your own devices to figure out where
you really were before you started.

(b) Uniform (shorts in those days) to be worn at all times

(c) Find a friendly farmer and ask for permission to camp

(d) All cooking to be done using utensils made from some tin foil

(e) Open fire to be used -- find your own dead wood, produce shavings to start the fire and then add
bigger and bigger pieces of wood until you had the fire going (those were the days when all
scouts carried a large sheath-knife on their belt without fear of being picked up by the police
for carrying an offensive weapon).

(f) Before leaving in the morning, thank the farmer and ask if he had a job he wanted doing.

(g) Get to the destination within the time limit.

Hmmmmmm ...... maybe things have changed slightly?

--
Jake

"marc" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

KRO said:

Quoted message said:

We have just told the troop that they are going on a 11 mile hike with over night camp and
that they will all need a rucksac , straight afterwards parents started asking what would be a
good rucksac to buy. Suggestions?

I see you've got plenty of suggestions, but as an aside is it more

difficult

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

these days to do these things?

To do what things?

QUOTE going on a 11 mile hike with over night camp UNQUOTE Seemed straightforward enough to me!

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Are there not numerous regulations etc to work through.

There are regulations , but in the main they are there to protect the YP

Yes, in the main.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I enjoyed this kind of thing when I was a boy with the scouts and cadets. My boy goes to scouts
but it's all trendy now - no uniform, which I think is a shame, though I'm not sure he'd go if
he had to,

No uniform, since when?admitadly the shirt is now blue, there is no hat and the trousers are more
modernly styled, but there certainly is a uniform.

Don't know how long, my boys been going for about a year and he hasn't been asked to wear the
uniform. I have picked him up from the hall and some boys are wearing the uniform, others "civvies".

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

teenagers are so image conscious these days. Aren't girls allowed in the Scouts these days, which
begs the question are boys allowed in the Guides! :-)

Boys are not allowed to join Guiding UK and most leaders would frown at boys being in the Guides (
in the other meaning that I took from your msg)

I'm at a loss over these other meanings? If boys are not allowed to join Guides but girls are
allowed to join the Scouts then this is discrimination. Not that they'd want to and they'd look
rather stupid in the uniform.

KRO

"Rifleman" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

* Look at the waist strap - make sure it can be done up,

Don't need one for normal walking - that's only useful over very rough terrain, and then I don't
always use it, so don't discount a model if it hasn't got a waist belt.

I cut the one off my 25L sack and I'd cut the one off my 35L if I didn't share it with someone. But
I do use the one on my backpacking 45L off and on for long days when it's fully loaded. I like to
swap the weight distribution about intermittently ...hip belt done up.... hip belt undone... slung
over right shoulder... slung over left shoulder. Also helps to keep your back from getting sweaty

"marc" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Of course, it could be said that he should have anticipated the question from parents and did
whatever updating he wanted to do *beforehand*.

Quoted message said:

True! :-(

But it came as a bit of a shock how few had rucksacs!

Didn't the scouts used to have the motto "Be prepared" or something like that.

"AndyP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

But it came as a bit of a shock how few had rucksacs!

Didn't the scouts used to have the motto "Be prepared" or something like that.

Thats the one.

KRO

Rifleman said:

"James Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:N4Q_b.855$44.800@newsfe1-win...

Quoted message said:

marc wrote:

* Look at the waist strap - make sure it can be done up,

Quoted message said:

Don't need one for normal walking - that's only useful over very rough terrain, and then I don't
always use it, so don't discount a model if it hasn't got a waist belt.

I find it easy to put enough into any sack of more than about 35 litres that a good *hip* strap
(it's meant for taking some of the pack weight directly onto the *hips*) means either I can carry it
comfortably a lot further, or I can carry a lot more weight. I wouldn't consider anything bigger
than a day sack without a *good* hip belt.

--
Chris Malcolm [email hidden] +44 (0)131 651 3445 DoD #205
IPAB, Informatics, JCMB, King's Buildings, Edinburgh, EH9 3JZ, UK
["]http://www.dai.ed.ac.uk/homes/cam/]

"KRO" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

teenagers are so image conscious these days. Aren't girls allowed in the Scouts these days,
which begs the question are boys allowed in the Guides! :-)

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Boys are not allowed to join Guiding UK and most leaders would frown at boys being in the Guides
( in the other meaning that I took from your msg)

Quoted message said:

I'm at a loss over these other meanings? If boys are not allowed to join Guides but girls are
allowed to join the Scouts then this is

discrimination.

Quoted message said:

Not that they'd want to and they'd look rather stupid in the uniform.

comedy art of the double entendre depending on your point of view. Get it? (Not as often as I'd
like Missus).

"GAGS" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Note I'm only talking about weighing bags on balances here when there is a need to do so, i.e.
when Scouts are entering a hiking competition in which there is a prescribed weight limit. (On
other occasions there's no need to be so accurate and a simple lift and estimate suffices.) If you
turn up to these events with an overweight bag then you either get heavily penalised

or

Quoted message said:

ultimately disqualified.

This sounds a bit odd to me. If it's some kind of competition why are they penalised for having an
overweight bag when it would only hinder them? Surely they should be penalised for having an
underweight bag that would be to their advantage? Or is completion time not the basis of the
competition? And if not what are the criteria for winning? Maybe this is all on the Scout website,
I'll go see.

AndyP said:

"marc" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

But it came as a bit of a shock how few had rucksacs!

Didn't the scouts used to have the motto "Be prepared" or something like that.

We train them to Be Prepared, they don't come to us like that.

--
John Russell CSL 1st Pinhoe Exeter Devon pinhoescouts.org.ukcubsOpen ↗ Cubs don't care how
much you know, but they need to know how much you care.

In article <[email hidden]>, jacko <[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

I know we don't know where Marc is taking his scouts, But when I was a VSL and on the district
activities team, we would have had reservations about the suitability of someone to lead a walk if
they had to ask somebody elses' advice about rucksacks ...

Marc is a CUB leader
--
Derek Biddle

"jacko" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I know we don't know where Marc is taking his scouts, But when I was a VSL and on the district
activities team, we would have had reservations about the suitability of someone to lead a walk if
they had to ask somebody elses' advice about rucksacks ...

Not only do you know nothing about where they are going, you also know nothing about Marc himself.
He could be the most sensible and trustworthy person in the world, with unparalleled knowledge and
experience of looking after young people out on the hills or wherever. This doesn't mean he knows
everything there is to know about rucsacs. So why give him a hard time for asking such a question?

There are far too many people 'contrubuting' to this forum who are too quick to question the
integrity of other users (and I use the term 'contributing' loosly, as I don't consider such
comments as a useful contribution).

If I had a child who was going on a trek, I'd much rather they were being looked after by a decent
person who knew nothing about rucsacs than some bigot who felt the need to express his over-inflated
feelings of self-importance at the first opportunity.

I ask you to read over your posting - in view of the original question and the majority of (helpful)
replies - and ask yourself: was that really necessary or helpful in any way whatsoever?

God bless the anonimity of the internet - before the www arrived guys like you only came out
at night...

Quoted message said:

Don't need one for normal walking - that's only useful over very rough terrain, and then I don't
always use it, so don't discount a model if it hasn't got a waist belt.

I have to say i completely disagree with the above comment, it the scouts are doing 11 miles they
will find it a lot more comfortable with a decent waist strap. lots of the regatta rucsacs have been
used my scouts for various trips and lightweight camping.

YiS

Mike Davis ACC Scouts (Cumbria) SL 1st G&C Scouts www.1stgcscouts.org.uk

For what its worth, my lot tend to buy ex-army bergens, which are comfortable, tough and adjustable,
something like goarmy.co.ukbuypage.aspOpen ↗, mind you
these retails at around £40 but we can normally get them for less tha £30 from a local shop

Models seem to vary but I wouldn't dream of going out without a good support belt.

Think about it, all of the sack weight will be going down your legs one way or another, but if you
use a belt only a percentage needs to go down your spine, which makes it easier to move around and
far more comfortable.

Tesco/Argos bags vary dramtiaclly, normally crappy thin straps that curl up into a curved knife edge
and poor seams, as a rule I avoid them.

--
--
Stephen Rainsbury
SL 8th Gillingham
DSL/DESA Gillingham District

"Mike Davis" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Don't need one for normal walking - that's only useful over very rough terrain, and then I don't
always use it, so don't discount a model if it hasn't got a waist belt.

I have to say i completely disagree with the above comment, it the scouts are doing 11 miles they
will find it a lot more comfortable with a decent waist strap. lots of the regatta rucsacs have
been used my scouts for various trips and lightweight camping.

Rubbish. A waist belt is primarily to stabilise the load when manoeuvring over very rough terrain.ie
on terrain where the rucksack would have a tendency to sway about, which does NOT happen on easy
ground unless the carrier is running. Believe me, I have carried loads in the past which most of you
wouldn't even get off the ground, so I know what I'm talking about.

"Paul Saunders" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Rifleman said:

Quoted message said:

Ha! I never used to travel that light. I typically carried 45 pounds or so.

You ARE joking, aren't you?

No.

Sheesh! WHY in God's name do you carry 45lbs?

You must be ABSOLUTELY BARKING!