Canal Towpaths

"Martin E Phillips" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

Indeed they do not. Am I the only person here to actually have a cycle permit?

Nope, I have one 😉 Den

Martin E Phillips said:

In message <[email hidden]> on Wed, 9 Jul 2003, Mike Gayler
<[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

I'm pretty sure that BW cycling permits do not have an expiry date.

Indeed they do not. Am I the only person here to actually have a cycle permit?

Wassail!

No; although I probably dont need one for the only bit of the towpath I cycle ( the Erewash Canal
between Dockholm Lock and Sandiacre) as it's an official cycle path. Nobody else locally appears to
bother. But it was free and it has no expiry date.

Best Wishes

Archie

James Hodson said:

Are there any rules on the British Waterways site that govern the behaviour of fisherpersons?

There probably are, but from reading the InterWeb and hanging out on uk.rec.waterways, it seems that
the worm drowners are not keen on observing them. There is a tale of one sitting atop a "no fishing"
sign, who declined to take note of an approaching boat until his line and keep net were wrapped
around the prop...

Dave Larrington - legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uklegslarry.beerdrinkers.co.ukOpen ↗
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Gonzalez said:

If steeds are allowed to ply the towpaths without let or hinderance, then surely bikes are
allowed too.

They aren't.

Horses are allowed on towpaths to pull boats (that is the purpose of a towpath). Other than that,
horses are not allowed.

Quoted message said:

I went on a canal boat holiday once. We carried the bikes on the roof of the narrow boat. Not once
did we consider the possibility that a permit may be required.

Very remiss of you.

You *DO* require a permit (available FOC from British Waterways), and are only permitted to use
some towpaths.

On Thu, 10 Jul 2003 12:30:16 +0100 someone who may be Dave Mayall <[email hidden]>
wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

Horses are allowed on towpaths to pull boats (that is the purpose of a towpath). Other than that,
horses are not allowed.

Except where they are:-)

The legality of riding horses, walking, cycling and doing all sorts of things on a towpath depends
on the individual circumstances concerned. Many canals were taken over by railways and later by
councils, with changes in the rules. Then there were the activities of the British Waterways Board
during their "Beeching" era.

--
David Hansen, Edinburgh | PGP email preferred-key number F566DA0E I will always explain revoked
keys, unless the UK government prevents me using the RIP Act 2000.

Dave Mayall said:

Gonzalez said:

If steeds are allowed to ply the towpaths without let or hinderance, then surely bikes are
allowed too.

They aren't.

Horses are allowed on towpaths to pull boats (that is the purpose of a towpath). .

But only with the express permission of BW , not necessarily given. Ridiculous but true. If your
Lister gave up and you decided a horse was a better option , contact BW and ask them first. That
aside, there are practical issues concerning trees growing between the towpath & canal , obstructing
the tow line and various other obstructions like "motor cycle" barriers planted across the towpath
requiring an athletic animal to bypass them. Believe me , I know about these things :-) Bill

Mike Gayler said:

I'm sure you are correct - towpaths are not public rights of way except for specific sections which
have been made rights of way. Hence towpaths are not shown as rights of way on OS maps. I'm pretty
sure that BW cycling permits do not have an expiry date.

Correct. BW cycling permits do not have an expiry date and are also extremely easy to acquire. Just
use this link: britishwaterways.co.ukApplyforacyclingpermit%255F519.aspOpen ↗ fill in the
minimal details requested, then download and print the permit yourself!

--
Kam Please do not reply by email. Any replies will automatically get binned.
--

Kam Ho email hidden in said:

Correct. BW cycling permits do not have an expiry date and are also extremely easy to acquire. Just
use this link: britishwaterways.co.ukApplyforacyclingpermit%255F519.aspOpen ↗ fill in
the minimal details requested, then download and print the permit yourself!

Or go to

britishwaterways.co.ukYOUR%20PERSONAL%20PERMIT.pdfOpen ↗

and don't fill in the minimal details requested!

--
Two cannibals eating a clown. One says to the other, "Does this taste funny to you?" To reply
replace the obvious bit with "richard"

When discussing with a Waterways Manager the possibility of taking a horse drawn narrowboat along
the Grand Union Canal a few years ago, I was told

" The towpath wasn't designed for horses."!!!

Fortunately (?) some of the above's colleagues were more enlightened!

Simon

"Mike Gayler" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

"David Brown :o\)" <[email hidden]> writed in :"]news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

"Gonzalez" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Canal towpaths were designed to be used by horses. When they were taken over by British
Waterways they were reclassified as public rights of way are now public bridleways. It would
take an act of parliament to change their status.

Are you sure on this? I didn't think that a towpath, by definition, was ever necessarily a
bridleway. I thought thay were 'towpaths', i.e. Public right of way that Horses can use.

I'm sure you are correct - towpaths are not public rights of way except for specific sections
which have been made rights of way. Hence towpaths are not shown as rights of way on OS maps. I'm
pretty sure that BW cycling permits do not have an expiry date.

I'm attempting to X-post this to uk.rec.waterways - who are a knowledgable bunch - and will surely
put us right!

Mike - Leicester - UK

Quoted message said:

Gonzalez said:

I went on a canal boat holiday once. We carried the bikes on the roof of the narrow boat. Not once
did we consider the possibility that a permit may be required.

Have a look at BWB's FAQ which covers cycling at
<http://www.britishwaterways.co.uk/site%2FCycling%5F489%2Easp>.

Not all canals belong to BWB of course, and other owners have different policies. Cycling is
officially banned on the Bridgewater Canal, for example, though there is a lot of pressure on Peel
Holdings to allow it on certain stretches.
--
Daisy Hill, Westhoughton, UK
============================

--
Remove"nospamplease" to e-mail me "David Hansen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Thu, 10 Jul 2003 12:30:16 +0100 someone who may be Dave Mayall <[email hidden]>
wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

Horses are allowed on towpaths to pull boats (that is the purpose of a towpath). Other than that,
horses are not allowed.

Except where they are:-)

The legality of riding horses, walking, cycling and doing all sorts of things on a towpath depends
on the individual circumstances concerned. Many canals were taken over by railways and later by
councils, with changes in the rules. Then there were the activities of the British Waterways Board
during their "Beeching" era.

--

Horses are only allowed on the towpath where it has become designated a bridleway. This is very rare
though and I only personally know of one location, and even that is in dispute. There was a local
hunt which claimed to have a longstanding right to pursue down a particular length of canal and
after long arguments and discussions they were allowed to resume this on the understanding that they
would pay the reinstatement costs after passage. After the first £multi-thousand bill was invoiced
for the repair of the resulting damage they never used the towpath again. It is an unfortunate fact
that horses make a huge mess of a towpath unless it has a hard surface, and then they don't like to
use it anyway, leaving it impassable in poor weather for other users. This and the current
environmental conditions of allowing plants etc to become established along the canal edge have
largely stopped horse towing. It is now only permitted on certain heritage lengths and by prior
agreement elsewhere. Again I can only personally think of the horse drawn trip boat based at Foxton
as an example of this, but no doubt many other such lengths exist around the system.

Dave Larrington said:

There is a tale of one sitting atop a "no fishing" sign, who declined to take note of an
approaching boat until his line and keep net were wrapped around the prop...

This actually happened to me (as steerer of a narrowboat taking out youth & schoolgroups). When the
angler told me "you'll never get that off", I dived into the engine room, came back with a 9" sheath
knife and a pair of bolt croppers and proceeded to prove him wrong. He tried for months to claim the
cost of his kit from my employer, but never got anything because, since he was fishing within 70ft
of a lock (sitting on the mooring bollard, in fact), he didn't have a leg to stand on.

BTW, when I worked on the canals, you still had to get a permit for cycling on the towpath because
they never were a right of way. Which is why you don't see them marked as such on the OS maps.
(Privately owned land & water). Whether this status has now changed I couldn't say, though you still
need a permit to take a horse on the towpath, which is probably a good idea, as (from experience)
many leisure boaters don't know what to do when faced with a moving boat attached to a rope that
stretches to the towpath 🙂

Colin

Daisy Hill said:

Have a look at BWB's FAQ which covers cycling at
<http://www.britishwaterways.co.uk/site%2FCycling%5F489%2Easp>.

Not all canals belong to BWB of course, and other owners have different policies. Cycling is
officially banned on the Bridgewater Canal, for example, though there is a lot of pressure on Peel
Holdings to allow it on certain stretches.

Does this mean that lock-wheeling is illegal in some flights?

Jonny

Ken Fowler said:

Horses are only allowed on the towpath where it has become designated a bridleway. This is very
rare though and I only personally know of one location, and even that is in dispute. There was a
local hunt which claimed to have a longstanding right to pursue down a particular length of canal
and after long arguments and discussions they were allowed to resume this on the understanding that
they would pay the reinstatement costs after passage. After the first £multi-thousand bill was
invoiced for the repair of the resulting damage they never used the towpath again. It is an
unfortunate fact that horses make a huge mess of a towpath unless it has a hard surface, and then
they don't like to use it anyway, leaving it impassable in poor weather for other users. This and
the current environmental conditions of allowing plants etc to become established along the canal
edge have largely stopped horse towing. It is now only permitted on certain heritage lengths and by
prior agreement elsewhere. Again I can only personally think of the horse drawn trip boat based at
Foxton as an example of this, but no doubt many other such lengths exist around the system.

So what would happen if someone were caught on a towpath without a permit? What standing in law does
the requirement to carry a permit have? If a cyclist challenged their right to use towpaths without
let or hinderance, how would the High Court react.

Given the ease of getting a permit, I would expect the High Court to decide it was surplus to
requirement and declare the towpaths open for recreational bicycle use.

However, I admit that I lack the wisdom and vision of a High Court judge, and I may well be wrong.
--
remove remove to reply

sid loves bananas said:

I have cycle from Gas Street Basin, Brum to Worcester 4 times, returning by train.

But according to the BWB, no cycling is allowed on that canal except from Birmingham as far as
Kings Norton.

Quoted message said:

It is a fantastic route and i cannot recommend it highly enough

There are a few odd bits when going around tunnels but it is mostly straightforward.

I have also done GSB to Stratford (good also) and Wolverhampton to GSB (interesting if you like
(post) industrial landscapes)

Same for the Stratford-upon-Avon Canal, except for a bit outside Stratford. (Though oddly only part
of it is actually marked on the ground as No Cycling.)

Quoted message said:

If you want any info on path quality etc let me know by posting here

Pete Barrett

On Thu, 10 Jul 2003 19:20:23 +0100, "Jonny Hodgson" <[email hidden]> put his pint

down said:

Daisy Hill said:

Have a look at BWB's FAQ which covers cycling at
<http://www.britishwaterways.co.uk/site%2FCycling%5F489%2Easp>.

Not all canals belong to BWB of course, and other owners have different policies. Cycling is
officially banned on the Bridgewater Canal, for example, though there is a lot of pressure on
Peel Holdings to allow it on certain stretches.

Does this mean that lock-wheeling is illegal in some flights?

Not on the Bridgewater - no locks!

Brian L Dominic

NB Rumpus

Web Sites:
NB Rumpus: www.nbrumpus.co.uk Friends of the Cromford Canal: www.cromfordcanal.org.uk Mid-Derbyshire
Light Railway: mderbyshire.lightrailway.btinternet.co.ukindex.htmlOpen ↗

I may work for British Waterways, but my opinions are my own.

yes you are quite right no cycling is allowed, but nobody has ever attempted to stop me

"Pete Barrett" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

sid loves bananas said:

I have cycle from Gas Street Basin, Brum to Worcester 4 times, returning

by

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

train.

But according to the BWB, no cycling is allowed on that canal except from Birmingham as far as
Kings Norton.

Quoted message said:

It is a fantastic route and i cannot recommend it highly enough

There are a few odd bits when going around tunnels but it is mostly straightforward.

I have also done GSB to Stratford (good also) and Wolverhampton to GSB (interesting if you like
(post) industrial landscapes)

Same for the Stratford-upon-Avon Canal, except for a bit outside Stratford. (Though oddly only
part of it is actually marked on the ground as No Cycling.)

Quoted message said:

If you want any info on path quality etc let me know by posting here

Pete Barrett

yes you are quite right no cycling is allowed, but nobody has ever attempted to stop me

i did brum to worcester 1998, 1999 twice and 2003

brum to stratford upon avon 1998

sid

"Pete Barrett" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

sid loves bananas said:

I have cycle from Gas Street Basin, Brum to Worcester 4 times, returning

by

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

train.

But according to the BWB, no cycling is allowed on that canal except from Birmingham as far as
Kings Norton.

Quoted message said:

It is a fantastic route and i cannot recommend it highly enough

There are a few odd bits when going around tunnels but it is mostly straightforward.

I have also done GSB to Stratford (good also) and Wolverhampton to GSB (interesting if you like
(post) industrial landscapes)

Same for the Stratford-upon-Avon Canal, except for a bit outside Stratford. (Though oddly only
part of it is actually marked on the ground as No Cycling.)

Quoted message said:

If you want any info on path quality etc let me know by posting here

Pete Barrett

"Brian Dominic" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Thu, 10 Jul 2003 19:20:23 +0100, "Jonny Hodgson" <[email hidden]> put his pint

down said:

Daisy Hill said:

Have a look at BWB's FAQ which covers cycling at
<http://www.britishwaterways.co.uk/site%2FCycling%5F489%2Easp>. Not all canals belong to BWB of
course, and other owners have different policies. Cycling is officially banned on the
Bridgewater Canal, for example, though there is a lot of pressure on Peel Holdings to allow it
on certain stretches.

Does this mean that lock-wheeling is illegal in some flights?

Not on the Bridgewater - no locks! Brian L Dominic

Also no cycling. (Legaly, They haven't caught me yet in 50 years))
--
Dave Croft Warrington England oldengine.orghomepageOpen ↗
community.webshots.comcrftdvOpen ↗

Ken Fowler said:

This and the current environmental conditions of allowing plants etc to become established along
the canal edge have largely stopped horse towing. It is now only permitted on certain heritage
lengths and by prior agreement elsewhere. Again I can only personally think of the horse drawn
trip boat based at Foxton as an example of this, but no doubt many other such lengths exist around
the system.

I have a vague recollection of there being a horse-drawn boat active on the K&A...

Dave Larrington - legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uklegslarry.beerdrinkers.co.ukOpen ↗
===========================================================
Editor - British Human Power Club Newsletter
bhpc.org.ukbhpc.org.ukOpen ↗
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