bikesandtrailers.com

"Phil Cook" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Tony Raven said:

Simon Brooke wrote on 18/02/2007 10:55 +0100:

Quoted message said:

My experience is with bike hods, which definitely can capsize under that
sort of provocation - but I never came off the bike in consequence. I
would imagine that a trailer with a hitch at axle level would be more
difficult to capsize.

I still plan to get a one wheeler as my next trailer, though - because
they
ought to cope better with fast downhill riding.

Yep, BOBs your uncle in the fast and/or downhill trailer stakes.

Quoted message said:

So my advice for the OP's situation with a long high speed hill would be
always to go for a single wheel trailer with a chainstay hitch. The BOB
is the best but won't work with a hub gear bike AFAIK.

Nuts! Specifically BOB nutz http://www.orbit-cycles.co.uk/bobnutz.html

NYKD
--
Phil Cook looking north over the park to the "Westminster Gasworks"

My Thorn Raven tour with Rohloff hub will take a Bob Yak -- no problem. It
has QR skewers.

I rode most of last year towing a Bob Yak nearly everywhere I went. I also
towed it under camping load from Mulhouse down the Rhein and back home. I
liked it very much and it gave me no problems at all. I just forgot it was
there most of the time and the trailer wheel track the rear wheel so you
don't have to worry about where the wheels of the trailer are going.

I am actually trying out a Carry Freedom Y Frame this year and to date I
don't like it very much -- it has a turning radius which cuts left hand
turns severely. However I will know it better after I try it under full load
in the last 2 weeks of March

By the way the towing hitch of my Y frame -- a simple universal joint came
apart and the trailer ran free in busy traffic last week! the whole hinging
system depends on two bolts with simple "self locking" nuts. Either of which
will let the trail hitch separate from the trailer arm!

Now it won't happen again 'cos I shall look at it before every journey but
it is a crappy bit of "engineering". And it isn't cheap --- if you buy a
decent waterproof sack to use, the 20" Y frame is virtually the same price
as the Bob Yak ( complete with flag and bag).

As I said I shall express my opinion at the end of March after I have done a
Spring warm up trip to Salisbury

--
Trevor A Panther
In South Yorkshire,
England, United Kingdom.
www.tapan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk

In article <[email hidden]>, Tony Raven
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

Rob Morley wrote on 18/02/2007 12:14 +0100:

Quoted message said:

Does anyone make a braked trailer, I wonder?

http://www.bikebiz.co.uk/Child-trailer-brake-is-stopped-in-its-tracks-trade-war-with-US-is-averted

EEK! Anyone know what's so special about Dr. Wobbin's patented brake
system?

"Pinky" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I rode most of last year towing a Bob Yak nearly everywhere I went. I also
towed it under camping load from Mulhouse down the Rhein and back home. I
liked it very much and it gave me no problems at all. I just forgot it was
there most of the time and the trailer wheel track the rear wheel so you
don't have to worry about where the wheels of the trailer are going.

I am actually trying out a Carry Freedom Y Frame this year and to date I
don't like it very much -- it has a turning radius which cuts left hand
turns severely. However I will know it better after I try it under full
load in the last 2 weeks of March

Why the change if you liked the Yak?

cheers,
clive

Tim Hall said:

David Hansen said:

On Sun, 18 Feb 2007 01:54:21 -0000 someone who may be Rob Morley
<[email hidden]> wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
raisethe
[email hidden] says...

> Right, I won't deal with them. I can't get a single wheel because of
> hub gears
Does that necessarily stop you fitting a single-track trailer?

Depends on the method of attachment. Some mountings will fit on hub
gears.

True. Bob-Yak for example do hub gear adaptors - I have some.

I have some, too.

In the wrong thread for my wheel. Sturmeys and Shimanoes use different
thread pitches. I'm keeping them to go on the Brommie when I get round
to it. And when I get the antifold clip for it.

A

Rob Morley wrote on 18/02/2007 15:46 +0100:

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>, Tony Raven
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

Rob Morley wrote on 18/02/2007 12:14 +0100:

Quoted message said:

Does anyone make a braked trailer, I wonder?

http://www.bikebiz.co.uk/Child-trailer-brake-is-stopped-in-its-tracks-trade-war-with-US-is-averted

EEK! Anyone know what's so special about Dr. Wobbin's patented brake
system?

<Miss Anne Elk>

And well you may ask. Yes, my word, you may well ask what it is, this
brake of mine. Well, this brake, that I have, that is to say, which is
mine,... is mine.

</Miss Anne Elk)

--
Tony

"...has many omissions and contains much that is apocryphal, or at least
wildly inaccurate..."
Douglas Adams; The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy

"Clive George" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Pinky" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

<snip><snip>

Quoted message said:

Why the change if you liked the Yak?

cheers,
clive

Quite simple really. I sold my Yak because the ICE recommended that the
Trice QNT recumbent, that I was about to take delivery of , would not like
the rigid hitch of the Bob Yak. So I sold it on CTC sales board ( and had 6
+ takers!)
Delivery of the QNT was cancelled after I fell out with ICE.

(I bought my Thorn Raven Tour instead and in the end I am happy that I did
so! I use my Thorn every day and the recumbent would not have been used
anywhere near as often.)

So I decided to give the Carry Freedom a try. Actually wish I had stayed
with my Yak but having sold it I thought it would be a good idea to try a
different approach.

I have already found that the Y frame will not go on many routes that were
no problem to my Yak.

However on camping tour I have organised a simple folding leg which will
give me a welcome table for my tent!

As I said wait a few weeks for a more informed opinion on the Carry Freedom

--
Trevor A Panther
In South Yorkshire,
England, United Kingdom.
www.tapan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk

Tony Raven <[email hidden]> wrote in news:53rf9lF1u0h4cU1
@mid.individual.net:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

EEK! Anyone know what's so special about Dr. Wobbin's patented brake
system?

<Miss Anne Elk>

And well you may ask. Yes, my word, you may well ask what it is, this
brake of mine. Well, this brake, that I have, that is to say, which is
mine,... is mine.

</Miss Anne Elk)

<chuckles>!

FWIW, I can't see what's so difficult about making a braking system for a
two-wheel trailer - and hence why Dr Wobbin is the only person in the world
to have "solved" this. Basing this instinctively on what my caravans have
used for years, and without any knowledge of how Dr Wobbin's system works,
all you need is an overrun mechanism in the drawbar feeding a couple of
discs (discs being easier to retrofit than rim brakes to most trailer
chassis). Using a brake balance arm the same way as caravans would sort out
balancing for cable-operated brakes, while hydraulic brakes would balance
themselves.

Of course, there'd be no auto-reverse, but do you need that with a
pushbike? If you need reverse, you could always have a horseshoe reversing
collar - just like caravans used to have.

Just a thought ...

That said, I suspect there isn't actually a need for trailer brakes other
than the "bling factor".

Will Cove wrote on 18/02/2007 17:39 +0100:

Quoted message said:

That said, I suspect there isn't actually a need for trailer brakes other
than the "bling factor".

It couldn't possibly be that Dr Wobbin who recommended to the standards
body that they were essential and who just happened to have the only
brake, which he had patented, that would meet his standard and which
just happened to be the only brake which the organisation for which he
worked had approved as meeting his standard, was hoping to make some
money for himself. That would be a conflict of interest.

--
Tony

"...has many omissions and contains much that is apocryphal, or at least
wildly inaccurate..."
Douglas Adams; The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy

In article <[email hidden]>, Tony Raven
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

Will Cove wrote on 18/02/2007 17:39 +0100:

Quoted message said:

That said, I suspect there isn't actually a need for trailer brakes other
than the "bling factor".

It couldn't possibly be that Dr Wobbin who recommended to the standards
body that they were essential and who just happened to have the only
brake, which he had patented, that would meet his standard and which
just happened to be the only brake which the organisation for which he
worked had approved as meeting his standard, was hoping to make some
money for himself. That would be a conflict of interest.

He said 'need', not 'motive'. :-)

Pinky said:

By the way the towing hitch of my Y frame -- a simple universal joint
came apart and the trailer ran free in busy traffic last week! the
whole hinging system depends on two bolts with simple "self locking"
nuts. Either of which will let the trail hitch separate from the
trailer arm!

You are not alone. I reported a similar failure last May:
<[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Now it won't happen again 'cos I shall look at it before every
journey but it is a crappy bit of "engineering".

It works OK for me now.
- take longer bolts
- use new Nylock nuts and Loctite
- for the bolt in the center use a second flat nut (M6, 3mm stark,
DIN 439) for securing just like on a bicycle hub

Günther

On Sun, 18 Feb 2007 17:56:47 +0000

Tony Raven said:

Will Cove wrote on 18/02/2007 17:39 +0100:

Quoted message said:

That said, I suspect there isn't actually a need for trailer brakes
other than the "bling factor".

It couldn't possibly be that Dr Wobbin who recommended to the
standards body that they were essential and who just happened to have
the only brake, which he had patented, that would meet his standard
and which just happened to be the only brake which the organisation
for which he worked had approved as meeting his standard, was hoping
to make some money for himself. That would be a conflict of interest.

Why?

It would be a conflict of interest if he were part of the
legislative process. But he's entitled to lobby for it.
If he is expert in his field, then presumably both his
invention (patent) and his guidelines represent what he
considers best practice. If he's a charlatan, then it
should be for the legislators to consult widely enough to
expose him, and it's not his fault if they fail.

If there were large backhanders involved, that would be
corruption. Not conflict of interest on his part, though.

Comparison: I might lobby for Open Standards in software
(particularly when public money is involved). I have an
interest in that: if a public body locks itself in to a
proprietary vendor-solution, then I am locked out, not
only from the project itself, but the (much larger)
ecosystem of subcontracts, spinoffs, etc around it.
Example: the BBC's proposed lock-in to Windows XP,
which threatens to lock out all technology innovation
except for black-hat "pirate" reverse engineering.

Is that a conflict of interest?

--
Nick Kew

Application Development with Apache - the Apache Modules Book
http://www.apachetutor.org/

Nick Kew wrote on 18/02/2007 20:32 +0100:

Quoted message said:

Why?

It would be a conflict of interest if he were part of the
legislative process.

I think you missed the part that said a Ministry of Transport Committee
recommended it became law and that he was a member of that Committee.
You also missed that this same Committee approved only his brake as
complying with the law. Now if those are not conflicts of interest I
don't know what are.

--
Tony

"...has many omissions and contains much that is apocryphal, or at least
wildly inaccurate..."
Douglas Adams; The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy

In article said:

Tony Raven <[email hidden]> wrote in news:53rf9lF1u0h4cU1
@mid.individual.net:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

EEK! Anyone know what's so special about Dr. Wobbin's patented brake
system?

<Miss Anne Elk>

And well you may ask. Yes, my word, you may well ask what it is, this
brake of mine. Well, this brake, that I have, that is to say, which is
mine,... is mine.

</Miss Anne Elk)

<chuckles>!

FWIW, I can't see what's so difficult about making a braking system for a
two-wheel trailer - and hence why Dr Wobbin is the only person in the world
to have "solved" this. Basing this instinctively on what my caravans have
used for years, and without any knowledge of how Dr Wobbin's system works,
all you need is an overrun mechanism in the drawbar feeding a couple of
discs (discs being easier to retrofit than rim brakes to most trailer
chassis).

I thought I'd seen a child trailer with such a system advertised (but
with drum brakes, I think), but either I imagined it or my Google skills
have deserted me.

Using a brake balance arm the same way as caravans would sort out

Quoted message said:

balancing for cable-operated brakes, while hydraulic brakes would balance
themselves.

Of course, there'd be no auto-reverse, but do you need that with a
pushbike? If you need reverse, you could always have a horseshoe reversing
collar - just like caravans used to have.

Just a thought ...

That said, I suspect there isn't actually a need for trailer brakes other
than the "bling factor".

Clive George said:

"raisethe" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Can these be ridden at speed (say 30 mph) with a reasonable load, or
is it best to take it easy? I have a 1000 foot descent back from Asda
with a 90 degree turn near the bottom.

1000 ft vertical? Where's that?

On his way back from Asda... 😉

--
Mike
Van Tuyl titanium Dura Ace 10
Fausto Coppi aluminium Ultegra 10
Raleigh Record Sprint mongrel

raisethe said:

Quoted message said:

I have a 1000 foot descent back from Asda

with a 90 degree turn near the bottom.

Whoops. I meant 'descend from 1,000 feet'. That makes a fair bit of a
difference. A quick check of my old Landranger reveals that it is
actually 1100 feet down to 500, a mere 600 ft descent. The key point
vis a vis trailer handling is the sharp turn at the fastest part of
the downhill stretch.

Quoted message said:

raisethe (') said:

I can't get a single wheel because of
hub gears

Why not?

The Bob Yak and EBC trailers use quick releases which are not
compatible with Nexus8.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

so I guess I will also have to get a cheap two wheeler.
Can these be ridden at speed (say 30 mph) with a reasonable load, or
is it best to take it easy? I have a 1000 foot descent back from Asda
with a 90 degree turn near the bottom.

My experience is with bike hods, which definitely can capsize under that
sort of provocation - but I never came off the bike in consequence. I
would imagine that a trailer with a hitch at axle level would be more
difficult to capsize.

Somehow your previous posts on a capsizing bike hod didn't put me off.
Wrestling a bucking trailer to a safe halt seems rather heroic. It is
more the jacknifing under braking that I am seeking to avoid.

Quoted message said:

I still plan to get a one wheeler as my next trailer, though - because they
ought to cope better with fast downhill riding.

Yes, the Bob Yak would certainly have been my first choice. Descending
is the only area where I am not hampered by being heavy so I don't
really want to ride downhilI on the brakes. My rear roller brake
wouldn't like it either. I would also consider using it for touring,
when taking camping stuff. I know that they do the Bob Nutz for hub
geared bikes but I was thinking it may be too onerous having to take
these on and off every time I use the trailer - having to straighten
the wheel each time etc. and also maybe the axle threads will
eventually strip under this weekly regime. (Or do the nuts only get
loosened? What exactly is the method in attaching a Bob Yak using Bob
Nutz? Anyone have this?).

So really a two wheeled conventional trailer is my third choice.

Quoted message said:

So my advice for the OP's situation with a long high speed hill would be
always to go for a single wheel trailer with a chainstay hitch. The BOB
is the best but won't work with a hub gear bike AFAIK.

--
Tony

I suppose what I want is a BOB with a chainstay hitch - but that
doen't sem to be available either.

or he lives

Quoted message said:

somewhere hilly, top of brynmawr to the lower end of gilwern is a 1000ft
drop, though the clydach gorge.

roger

Is there an Asda at the top of that?!

raisethe said:

or he lives

Quoted message said:

somewhere hilly, top of brynmawr to the lower end of gilwern is a 1000ft
drop, though the clydach gorge.

roger

Is there an Asda at the top of that?!

heh yes attaully. where the semtex factory was, the boiler house
remains, though it's attaully in Nantyglo not brynmawr.

roger

raisethe said:

Yes, the Bob Yak would certainly have been my first choice. Descending
is the only area where I am not hampered by being heavy so I don't
really want to ride downhilI on the brakes. My rear roller brake
wouldn't like it either. I would also consider using it for touring,
when taking camping stuff. I know that they do the Bob Nutz for hub
geared bikes but I was thinking it may be too onerous having to take
these on and off every time I use the trailer - having to straighten
the wheel each time etc. and also maybe the axle threads will
eventually strip under this weekly regime. (Or do the nuts only get
loosened? What exactly is the method in attaching a Bob Yak using Bob
Nutz? Anyone have this?).

There's no need to change the nuts at all once they've been fixed.

The trailer just clips over them, and the reason you need different nuts
is so that it's possible to clip the trailer onto the nuts.

A