Average MPH

Quoted message said:

The easiest way to tell how much weight you will loose is to go out and
do it, and after a month, see how much weight you have lost. Plenty of
people put in so much effort trying to get the most "bang for the buck"
that they never actually do *anything*.

Austin

Yeah, I think it must be all the false claims of this and that diet and
pills and medication and operations and gene therapy 😉, that is so
disheartening when they have to undoubtedly fail. Why pay big bucks for
something that is free. We are brainwashed.
Society pushes you to be skinny if you are female and husky if a male. They
get paid to look that way so it is not normal for you and me.
Start walking, gardening, renovating, buy a dog and make sure you do the
right thing and exercise her/him.
News years resolutions. Now that will be an interesting topic. I never
make 'em. Not that I am perfect but it is too much pressure.

"gds" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

That always irritates me when people claim some particular average or
riding time for a century or something, and then I find out it is only
"riding" time, not actual time.

Joseph

Why does it irritate you? It is just another measure and for some
purposes it is appropriate and for other purposes less so.

A personal example. Last year I did a century with a friend and we both
trained hard and planned on using the ride as a good measure of our
current fitness. However, during the ride my friend had a mechanical
issue that took us ~30 minutes to resolve. At the end we both were very
happy with our "riding" average as we felt that it was a better
indicator of our fitness level than the "total" average.
Of course if the idea of the ride was to "win" as in a race then
clearly the total time/average would be the better measure.

But your result that day would be better than actual because you had 30
minutes to rest. You could not use those results unless you compared it to
another day with a 30 minute mishap.

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

gds said:

Quoted message said:

That always irritates me when people claim some particular average or
riding time for a century or something, and then I find out it is only
"riding" time, not actual time.

Joseph

Why does it irritate you? It is just another measure and for some
purposes it is appropriate and for other purposes less so.

A personal example. Last year I did a century with a friend and we both
trained hard and planned on using the ride as a good measure of our
current fitness. However, during the ride my friend had a mechanical
issue that took us ~30 minutes to resolve. At the end we both were very
happy with our "riding" average as we felt that it was a better
indicator of our fitness level than the "total" average.
Of course if the idea of the ride was to "win" as in a race then
clearly the total time/average would be the better measure.

I guess it doesn't ALWAYS irritate me. I was thinking in particular of
the times when the context made riding time not really the relavent
info.

The riding average can be a useful and informative piece of info, but
on it's own it can be quite misleading, and when it is used in a
misleading (intentional or not) way, that is irritating.

Joseph

You just want to make sure the comparison is equal.

Roger Zoul said:

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]
:: Doc O'Leary wrote:
::: In article <YMmgh.481377$5R2.19648@pd7urf3no>,
::: "nash" <[email hidden]> wrote:
:::
:::: What are your average MPH when doing a normal commute
:::: or training ride?
:::
::: I don't bother to monitor it. When I want to get
::: somewhere on a schedule, I just figure I can easily
::: average 15mph and plan for the distance I need to go.
::: When training, I just push myself harder than I
::: normally would. Most of the people who get into
::: pissing matches about speed are the kind of people that
::: don't count the time they spend at stop lights.
:::
::
:: That always irritates me when people claim some
:: particular average or riding time for a century or
:: something, and then I find out it is only "riding" time,
:: not actual time.

I don't get it. Why not count riding time in an average? Who'd want to count
anything else?

Well, if you're a utility cyclist average riding time is meaningless,
I need to know how long the trip takes, not the time in the saddle. It
is giving distances in hours which is one of my pet peeves when I hear
it on the radio. Someone will say that X is an hour from Y. By what
means? Car, helicopter, F18, ox cart, canoe, bicycle, walking?

I really don't care what my average riding speed is. I want to know how
much time it takes to go from A to B. The only time average riding
speed is any important is if I know how far it is to my destination and
I need to get there in specific amount of time.

Tell me that it is a four hour ride from London to Toronto and this
means that I can leave at 7:00 AM and still meet friends in the city
for lunch at 12:00. OOPS, you forgot to mention that you need to
allow an hour and a half for rest breaks. Oh well they won't mind
waiting at the subway station for half an hour.

John Kane, Kingston ON Canada

"John Kane" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Michael Warner said:

John Kane said:

I'm a fairly slow rider and seldom average more than 20 km/h on a
commute or even when on a solo ride. Thirty-two km/h is for the lyca
louts with 10 year of steady training.

It doesn't take 10 years, just a good aero position on a decent bike and
a couple of years of regular solid riding. And age doesn't make much
difference.

Age?

Well it depends on where and how you're riding ISTM. I can easily hold
32 km/h for a hour or two on a group ride in the country (assuming wind
and hills permit, of course) but 32 km/h when traveling or commuting
is, I think, another matter.

I'm talking elapsed time over distance, not time on the bike. I have
done a number of rides over the same route and come in pretty
consistantly for 100 km at 20 km/h which includes lunch, pit stops,
etc. Oh and with panniers.

An old friend who was in a German cycle troop in WWII seemed to agree
with me that a 20 km/h time was reasonable. Of course he was riding
single speed and fully equipped for combat 🙂

John Kane, Kingston ON Canada

Okay, we have a communication bread down again.
The poster I was questioning said 20MPH. not KPH
I tried to make that clear.
Then we all think 20MPH for 3 hours is out of the question for an intial
exercise program. I am the OP and thought we should be clear here. I hope
the exerciser in question read our thread.

"Roger Zoul" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]
:: Doc O'Leary wrote:
::: In article <YMmgh.481377$5R2.19648@pd7urf3no>,
::: "nash" <[email hidden]> wrote:
:::
:::: What are your average MPH when doing a normal commute
:::: or training ride?
:::
::: I don't bother to monitor it. When I want to get
::: somewhere on a schedule, I just figure I can easily
::: average 15mph and plan for the distance I need to go.
::: When training, I just push myself harder than I
::: normally would. Most of the people who get into
::: pissing matches about speed are the kind of people that
::: don't count the time they spend at stop lights.
:::
::
:: That always irritates me when people claim some
:: particular average or riding time for a century or
:: something, and then I find out it is only "riding" time,
:: not actual time.

I don't get it. Why not count riding time in an average? Who'd want to
count anything else?

If you do not count recovery time as a misnomer when comparing to another
group I think you send the wrong message. Recovery is going to give you a
better speed. You start out again stronger than when you quit.

Roger Zoul said:

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]
:: Roger Zoul wrote:
::: <[email hidden]> wrote in message
::: news:[email hidden]
::::: Doc O'Leary wrote:
:::::: In article <YMmgh.481377$5R2.19648@pd7urf3no>,
:::::: "nash" <[email hidden]> wrote:
::::::
::::::: What are your average MPH when doing a normal
::::::: commute or training ride?
::::::
:::::: I don't bother to monitor it. When I want to get
:::::: somewhere on a schedule, I just figure I can easily
:::::: average 15mph and plan for the distance I need to go.
:::::: When training, I just push myself harder than I
:::::: normally would. Most of the people who get into
:::::: pissing matches about speed are the kind of people
:::::: that don't count the time they spend at stop lights.
::::::
:::::
::::: That always irritates me when people claim some
::::: particular average or riding time for a century or
::::: something, and then I find out it is only "riding"
::::: time, not actual time.
:::
::: I don't get it. Why not count riding time in an
::: average? Who'd want to count anything else?
::
:: Because it's apples and oranges. If someone does a 180km
:: ride in 6 hours including 1 hour of pit-stops, that is a
:: big difference from taking 5 hours including 1 hour of
:: pit-stops. If the first riders says they did it in 5
:: hours, the second is given a bum steer.
::
:: Joseph

Just report actually riding time and you're golden. It's when you don't do
that that problems start.

No it depends on the purpose. Unless you're racing actual riding time
is meaningless, well, not meaningless but not particularly informative.
Both figures riding time and elapsed time together are meaningful.

Reporting actual riding time is like saying you drove from New York to
Los Angles in 56 hours at an average speed of 80 km/h. Now this is
probably possible but how likely are you to do it? No stops for gas,
no meals outside the car, no sleep?

John Kane, Kingston ON Canada

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>Resting makes a difference. It's the old turtle vs. hare story --
>there's

no getting beyond your actual fitness, whether you go fast with rests, or
slower with no rests.

Matt O.

the difference is the turtle won. You do want to win right.
I am just saying again that it is not a fair race. the same fitness means
it should be a close race. When you rest your ride time will be better so
you won even though you were an hour late to the finish line.
Can't see TdeF changing on that one.

"John Kane" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]
:: Roger Zoul wrote:
::: "John Kane" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
::: news:[email hidden]
::::: [email hidden] wrote:
:::::: Doc O'Leary wrote:
::::::: In article <YMmgh.481377$5R2.19648@pd7urf3no>,
::::::: "nash" <[email hidden]> wrote:
:::::::
:::::::: What are your average MPH when doing a normal
:::::::: commute or training ride?
:::::::
::::::: I don't bother to monitor it. When I want to get
::::::: somewhere on a schedule, I just figure I can easily
::::::: average 15mph and plan for the distance I need to
::::::: go. When training, I just push myself harder than I
::::::: normally would. Most of the people who get into
::::::: pissing matches about speed are the kind of people
::::::: that don't count the time they spend at stop lights.
:::::::
::::::
:::::: That always irritates me when people claim some
:::::: particular average or riding time for a century or
:::::: something, and then I find out it is only "riding"
:::::: time, not actual time.
:::::
::::: Good point, I did a ride in about 9 hours (180km) and
::::: at work the next day I asked a college how the ride
::::: went and he said it was great and his group had done
::::: it in 5 hours. EH! Turns out it was riding time. He
::::: forgot the hour spent swimming etc.
:::
::: So, he did the riding, swimming, etc in 6 hours. Pretty
::: good, considering.
::
:: Yes, he is a strong rider and has a good strong group to
:: ride with. He's certainly a lot faster than I am under
:: normal circumstances and more competative. My normal
:: group has no desire to ride fast, we just like to
:: arrive. 🙂

That would describe me as well. I do like to know how long it took though.
I only compete with myself.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>>Car, helicopter, F18, ox cart, canoe, bicycle, walking?

You forgot dragon slayer.
Who is telling you it takes such and such a time?
A bike group I would think if you are cycling.
Can't you just ask?

"John Kane" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]
:: Roger Zoul wrote:
::: <[email hidden]> wrote in message
::: news:[email hidden]
::::: Doc O'Leary wrote:
:::::: In article <YMmgh.481377$5R2.19648@pd7urf3no>,
:::::: "nash" <[email hidden]> wrote:
::::::
::::::: What are your average MPH when doing a normal
::::::: commute or training ride?
::::::
:::::: I don't bother to monitor it. When I want to get
:::::: somewhere on a schedule, I just figure I can easily
:::::: average 15mph and plan for the distance I need to go.
:::::: When training, I just push myself harder than I
:::::: normally would. Most of the people who get into
:::::: pissing matches about speed are the kind of people
:::::: that don't count the time they spend at stop lights.
::::::
:::::
::::: That always irritates me when people claim some
::::: particular average or riding time for a century or
::::: something, and then I find out it is only "riding"
::::: time, not actual time.
:::
::: I don't get it. Why not count riding time in an
::: average? Who'd want to count anything else?
::
:: Well, if you're a utility cyclist average riding time
:: is meaningless, I need to know how long the trip takes,
:: not the time in the saddle. It is giving distances in
:: hours which is one of my pet peeves when I hear it on
:: the radio. Someone will say that X is an hour from Y. By
:: what means? Car, helicopter, F18, ox cart, canoe,
:: bicycle, walking?
::
:: I really don't care what my average riding speed is. I
:: want to know how much time it takes to go from A to B.
:: The only time average riding speed is any important is
:: if I know how far it is to my destination and I need to
:: get there in specific amount of time.
::
:: Tell me that it is a four hour ride from London to
:: Toronto and this means that I can leave at 7:00 AM and
:: still meet friends in the city for lunch at 12:00.
:: OOPS, you forgot to mention that you need to allow an
:: hour and a half for rest breaks. Oh well they won't mind
:: waiting at the subway station for half an hour.

I don't have a problem with wanting to know how long a commute to work
takes, with stops and traffic and all, it's obvious that that's the
important time. But that doesn't mean that one can't also clock the average
speed while riding, as computers do that very well. Hence, it's simply a
matter of knowing what's important when and making proper distinctions.
Clock time or riding time, big dooh.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Do you really think 20mph is normal.

No, not for ordinary people riding alone.
It is believable if they are in good physical shape, and pacelining.

Alternately it might be possible if they are riding alone on an aero
recumbent bike like a highracer or lowracer.

OR with aerobars on a track. 🙂

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>Maybe the physical workouts one can derive from riding

oughtn't be expressed in distance/time, so much as in
power output/time.

And how would we do that keemasabee?

In article <wvYgh.496033$R63.87535@pd7urf1no>,

nash said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>>Maybe the physical workouts one can derive from riding

oughtn't be expressed in distance/time, so much as in
power output/time.

And how would we do that keemasabee?

Bionic wattmeters :-)

cheers,
Tom

--
Nothing is safe from me.
Above address is just a spam midden.
I'm really at: tkeats curlicue vcn dot bc dot ca

Quoted message said:

Fitness is hard to measure, anyway. If I weigh 50 lbs more than you and we
both complete the same course in the same amount of time, who is fitter? If
you beat me my 5 minutes, does that make you fitter?

Depends. Is that 50 pounds of fat or muscle?

Chris Neary
[email hidden]

"Science, freedom, beauty, adventure: what more could
you ask of life? Bicycling combined all the elements I
loved" - Adapted from a quotation by Charles Lindbergh

Quoted message said:

For longer rides (4+ hours) I think it makes a big difference.

Short breaks do. Longer breaks will have little additional benefit.

Just another reason why riding time is a better measure than total time.

Chris Neary
[email hidden]

"Science, freedom, beauty, adventure: what more could
you ask of life? Bicycling combined all the elements I
loved" - Adapted from a quotation by Charles Lindbergh

John Kane said:

Roger Zoul said:

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]
:: Roger Zoul wrote:
::: <[email hidden]> wrote in message
::: news:[email hidden]
::::: Doc O'Leary wrote:
:::::: In article <YMmgh.481377$5R2.19648@pd7urf3no>,
:::::: "nash" <[email hidden]> wrote:
::::::
::::::: What are your average MPH when doing a normal
::::::: commute or training ride?
::::::
:::::: I don't bother to monitor it. When I want to get
:::::: somewhere on a schedule, I just figure I can easily
:::::: average 15mph and plan for the distance I need to go.
:::::: When training, I just push myself harder than I
:::::: normally would. Most of the people who get into
:::::: pissing matches about speed are the kind of people
:::::: that don't count the time they spend at stop lights.
::::::
:::::
::::: That always irritates me when people claim some
::::: particular average or riding time for a century or
::::: something, and then I find out it is only "riding"
::::: time, not actual time.
:::
::: I don't get it. Why not count riding time in an
::: average? Who'd want to count anything else?
::
:: Because it's apples and oranges. If someone does a 180km
:: ride in 6 hours including 1 hour of pit-stops, that is a
:: big difference from taking 5 hours including 1 hour of
:: pit-stops. If the first riders says they did it in 5
:: hours, the second is given a bum steer.
::
:: Joseph

Just report actually riding time and you're golden. It's when you don't do
that that problems start.

No it depends on the purpose. Unless you're racing actual riding time
is meaningless, well, not meaningless but not particularly informative.
Both figures riding time and elapsed time together are meaningful.

Reporting actual riding time is like saying you drove from New York to
Los Angles in 56 hours at an average speed of 80 km/h. Now this is
probably possible but how likely are you to do it? No stops for gas,
no meals outside the car, no sleep?

John Kane, Kingston ON Canada

Does that mean I am REALLY only 23 years old?

Joseph

Roger Zoul said:

"John Kane" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]
:: Roger Zoul wrote:
::: <[email hidden]> wrote in message
::: news:[email hidden]
::::: Doc O'Leary wrote:
:::::: In article <YMmgh.481377$5R2.19648@pd7urf3no>,
:::::: "nash" <[email hidden]> wrote:
::::::
::::::: What are your average MPH when doing a normal
::::::: commute or training ride?
::::::
:::::: I don't bother to monitor it. When I want to get
:::::: somewhere on a schedule, I just figure I can easily
:::::: average 15mph and plan for the distance I need to go.
:::::: When training, I just push myself harder than I
:::::: normally would. Most of the people who get into
:::::: pissing matches about speed are the kind of people
:::::: that don't count the time they spend at stop lights.
::::::
:::::
::::: That always irritates me when people claim some
::::: particular average or riding time for a century or
::::: something, and then I find out it is only "riding"
::::: time, not actual time.
:::
::: I don't get it. Why not count riding time in an
::: average? Who'd want to count anything else?
::
:: Well, if you're a utility cyclist average riding time
:: is meaningless, I need to know how long the trip takes,
:: not the time in the saddle. It is giving distances in
:: hours which is one of my pet peeves when I hear it on
:: the radio. Someone will say that X is an hour from Y. By
:: what means? Car, helicopter, F18, ox cart, canoe,
:: bicycle, walking?
::
:: I really don't care what my average riding speed is. I
:: want to know how much time it takes to go from A to B.
:: The only time average riding speed is any important is
:: if I know how far it is to my destination and I need to
:: get there in specific amount of time.
::
:: Tell me that it is a four hour ride from London to
:: Toronto and this means that I can leave at 7:00 AM and
:: still meet friends in the city for lunch at 12:00.
:: OOPS, you forgot to mention that you need to allow an
:: hour and a half for rest breaks. Oh well they won't mind
:: waiting at the subway station for half an hour.

I don't have a problem with wanting to know how long a commute to work
takes, with stops and traffic and all, it's obvious that that's the
important time. But that doesn't mean that one can't also clock the average
speed while riding, as computers do that very well. Hence, it's simply a
matter of knowing what's important when and making proper distinctions.
Clock time or riding time, big dooh.

There is no question in my mind that riding time/average speed is a
very important parameter. Seen by itself it is not very informative
about the whole picture, but it is certainly something I'd like to know
on a timed ride like a century. It's just that I would only consider it
a supporting fact, not the result.

Joseph

"Chris Neary" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Fitness is hard to measure, anyway. If I weigh 50 lbs more than you and
we
both complete the same course in the same amount of time, who is fitter?
If
you beat me my 5 minutes, does that make you fitter?

Depends. Is that 50 pounds of fat or muscle?

How does that work if you are going downhill. Any advantage being heavier?

nash said:

"Chris Neary" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Fitness is hard to measure, anyway. If I weigh 50 lbs more than you and
we
both complete the same course in the same amount of time, who is fitter?
If
you beat me my 5 minutes, does that make you fitter?

Depends. Is that 50 pounds of fat or muscle?

How does that work if you are going downhill. Any advantage being heavier?

I weigh now a svelte 215lbs, down from more. On our club rides, there
is nobody who can even hold my wheel downhill when I am spinning my
53x12. Of course I can't hold their wheel going up the other side...

Joseph

Joseph