cold weather Q?

In article <[email protected]>,
"~R" <[email protected]> wrote:

> How cold does it have to be for one to consider themselves a
> hardcore rider? I rode to work in 39 degree F weather yesterday
> and this thought popped into my head. It was pleasant, but it's
> getting colder every day.

let your conscience be your guide. I imagine there are different
scales for recreational riding vs. cyclecommuting.

For my group of commuting buddies, it generally means riding as much in
the winter as the summer, without regard for sneaux* and ice, or
(especially) low temps.

Temperature is never ever an excuse; in fact, the colder it is, the
more compelled everyone is to ride. We're good to around -20 F thus far
over the last four or five years, but can go somewhat lower.


*There are practicality caveats for fresh deep snow-- we don't
particularly relish 3 hour rides _to_ work, and after a certain point
it's easier to carry the bike on one's back than ride.

..max

"~R" <[email protected]> wrote in news:WG35f.16018$vw6.13101
@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net:

> How cold does it have to be for one to consider themselves a
> hardcore rider? I rode to work in 39 degree F weather yesterday
> and this thought popped into my head. It was pleasant, but it's
> getting colder every day.
>
> Looking at http://www.icebike.com makes the whole winter-riding
> concept look very apealing!
>
> ~Rob
>
>
>

I don't consider myself a hardcore rider, by any means. I've been a
wuss, these past couple of years. But, I've ridden down to 0F (-10F wind
chill), with no problems at all. Cold shouldn't be an excuse, until it
gets well into the negative numbers (say, -20 or below, I guess - maybe
lower, I dunno). Once it gets too far down there, being outside gets
more dangerous. But, for the most part, if you dress properly, you won't
even notice the cold at all.

At 39F, you're just getting out of shorts weather! I wouldn't consider
that hardcore. I don't think you were, either. I've been wearing shorts
down into the mid 40s (44-46F), but do notice that my knees are getting
stiffer as I approach the 40F mark. So, for me, 43F is probably the
cutoff point to put the cheap Target nylon sweatpants on.

As far as winter riding goes, depends on whether you're talking
commuting, or trail riding. I think I'd have no problems trail riding in
most conditions in the winter (think it'd be pretty fun, actually,
though I haven't tried it, yet).

But, I don't care to bike commute to work in snowy, slushy conditions. I
tried it once, to see what it was like, and felt scared for my life the
whole time I was riding in traffic. I have about a 14-mile one-way
commute, with about 7 of it in moderately heavy city traffic. My front
tire kept wanting to go the path of the car tire tracks, especially when
I hit the cross streets. I felt that my tire could have twisted, and I
could have slipped down at any given time. And, riding in the city,
slipping could have meant slipping under a car, truck, bus or semi. That
would NOT have been fun! So, I decided, that day, that I'll only bike
commute in the winter if the roads are clear, and I'm relatively certain
they'll still be clear on the way home.

Now, I know a number of people here in Milwaukee who ride all year long,
no matter what the conditions are. They have no problems riding in snow,
slush, or ice. Just throw a set of studded tires on, and away you go!
They find it fun! They're more hardcore than me. I'm just not made for
it, I guess.

Just another case of 'to each his/her own'.

I hope you do try winter riding, whether for commuting purposes, or just
for fun. You may find that you like it more than summer riding!!! And, I
personally think you get more respect from not only other bicyclists,
but some cagers, too!!! Well, and some cagers will just think you're
psycho, but, don't worry about them. ;-)

Good luck, and have fun!!!

--
Eric Babula
Milwaukee, Wisconsin, USA

Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention
of arriving safely in a pretty and well-preserved body.
But rather, it’s to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up,
totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming, 'Wow! What a ride!!!'

"~R" <[email protected]> wrote:

>How cold does it have to be for one to consider themselves a
>hardcore rider? I rode to work in 39 degree F weather yesterday
>and this thought popped into my head. It was pleasant, but it's
>getting colder every day.

You're hardcore if, when you spit, it shatters when it hits the
ground. ;-)

Mark "which is why I live in the desert now" Hickey
Habanero Cycles
http://www.habcycles.com
Home of the $795 ti frame

"~R" wrote ...
> How cold does it have to be for one to consider themselves a
> hardcore rider? I rode to work in 39 degree F weather yesterday
> and this thought popped into my head. It was pleasant, but it's
> getting colder every day.
>
> Looking at http://www.icebike.com makes the whole winter-riding
> concept look very apealing!
>
> ~Rob
>
>
I've been commuting year round for about 4 years now, and yes, it does snow
where I live. The right clothing and equipment can make subfreezing
temperatures enjoyable, but maybe you have to be a certain kind of person to
start with to really enjoy winter cycling. Every year it seems like there's
a few more bicycle tracks in the snow on my route to and from work, so it
must be catching on around here!
--
mark

~R wrote:
> How cold does it have to be for one to consider themselves a
> hardcore rider?

I think you're hardcore if you ride unless it's physically impossible.

I'm far from that, myself. Snow and ice stop me. Cold rain usually
stops me. Cold alone doesn't (or hasn't so far, down to 20F anyway,
which is as cold as it usually gets around Philly), and rain doesn't if
it's above 50 degrees or so.

If my commute were significantly shorter than an hour each way, I might
be braver.

I guess I'm soft-core.

RichC

~R wrote:
> How cold does it have to be for one to consider themselves a
> hardcore rider? I rode to work in 39 degree F weather yesterday
> and this thought popped into my head. It was pleasant, but it's
> getting colder every day.
>
> Looking at http://www.icebike.com makes the whole winter-riding
> concept look very apealing!
>
> ~Rob

Well I have stopped at -59 C (with windchill) because the bike was
freezing up (freewheel pawl was taking about 30 seconds to fall). Good
thing too. I was not really prepared for it and probably would have
gotten frostbite on the ride to work.

Much below -25 C and I find it is getting cold. OTOH I wonder just how
hot it can get before stopping riding. I don't think I've ever cycled
in anything over about +43 C. Either extreme is something to worry
about.

Around here I think that between about +4 & -4C (your 39F is in there
somewhere) can be the most uncomfortable riding weather. It is
diffucult to dress for and there is a problem of getting wet.

18 Oct 2005 12:11:01 GMT,
<[email protected]>,
Eric Babula <[email protected]> wrote, in part:

>At 39F, you're just getting out of shorts weather! I wouldn't consider
>that hardcore. I don't think you were, either. I've been wearing shorts
>down into the mid 40s (44-46F), but do notice that my knees are getting
>stiffer as I approach the 40F mark. So, for me, 43F is probably the
>cutoff point to put the cheap Target nylon sweatpants on.

I must be a wuss because I get out the knickers when it starts getting
below 50F.

>And, I
>personally think you get more respect from not only other bicyclists,
>but some cagers, too!!! Well, and some cagers will just think you're
>psycho, but, don't worry about them. ;-)

I don't know if it's respect but it does seem that I get more room
when it's only us whack jobs are out riding.

Which reminds me, it's time to get another box of sheet metal screws
and replace the "studs" I ground down on last year's prolonged patchy
and polished frozen slop. I like being ready to roll in the snow, just
in case we get any.
--
zk

"Mark Hickey" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news[email protected]...
: "~R" <[email protected]> wrote:
: You're hardcore if, when you spit, it shatters when it hits the
: ground. ;-)
:
: Mark "which is why I live in the desert now" Hickey


Good answer! 39 F was not too cold, but it just got me thinking
about how cold it's gonna get real soon here in north east ohio.
My ride to work is only 5 miles each way, but it's 100% hills. up
and down. seems like most of my time is spent going UP, though.
I'll be checking my spit to see if it shatters, but we should all
make sure not to spit into the wind!
~Rob

I'm another Milwaukee area bike commuter, who hasn't been stopped by the
cold since I've been keeping daily records in 1993. Coldest riding day in
that period was -15F. There have been a couple of colder days here over
those years, but I rode in the "heat" of the afternoon those days. Snow and
ice have, from time to time, forced me not to commute, though I've always
gotten in at least some riding in the course of the day/evening. The plows
and salt trucks are ubiquitous and do a good job here (at least on the
arterials), so you're rarely completely shut down for long. The most
difficult day was the Jan 2, 1999 blizzard, when I waited for the snowplow
to come by on our street, and then rode up and down that street a bunch of
times for 5 miles of riding. Close behind it was a week in Madison before
Christmas a few years ago that featured an unusual combination of snow and
bitter cold. One evening that week, I went to a tavern where my sister's
blue grass band was playing (She didn't know I was in town). Her first
reaction on seeking an abominable snowman type character come in was to ask
herself: "Who's that idiot out biking tonight. Then came the realization:
"That's my brother!" My most embarrassing day was warmer - a 35 F wind
driven rain in early April that I wan't prepared for with adequate
clothing - I had to pull into a fast food place after 7 miles of riding and
call and ask my wife to come get me - I couldn't stay warm enough!

I had studded snow tires but found them insufficiently helpful to keep.
They help on ice but not otherwise, at the price of being very slow and very
noisy. My zero mileage days since 1998 are limited to 23 days off in 2003,
when I was hit by a car and separated a shoulder, 26 days off this past
summer, while recovering from surgery, and one day lost in 2004 due to
travel.





"Eric Babula" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "~R" <[email protected]> wrote in news:WG35f.16018$vw6.13101
> @newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net:
>
>> How cold does it have to be for one to consider themselves a
>> hardcore rider? I rode to work in 39 degree F weather yesterday
>> and this thought popped into my head. It was pleasant, but it's
>> getting colder every day.
>>
>> Looking at http://www.icebike.com makes the whole winter-riding
>> concept look very apealing!
>>
>> ~Rob
>>
>>
>>
>
> I don't consider myself a hardcore rider, by any means. I've been a
> wuss, these past couple of years. But, I've ridden down to 0F (-10F wind
> chill), with no problems at all. Cold shouldn't be an excuse, until it
> gets well into the negative numbers (say, -20 or below, I guess - maybe
> lower, I dunno). Once it gets too far down there, being outside gets
> more dangerous. But, for the most part, if you dress properly, you won't
> even notice the cold at all.
>
> At 39F, you're just getting out of shorts weather! I wouldn't consider
> that hardcore. I don't think you were, either. I've been wearing shorts
> down into the mid 40s (44-46F), but do notice that my knees are getting
> stiffer as I approach the 40F mark. So, for me, 43F is probably the
> cutoff point to put the cheap Target nylon sweatpants on.
>
> As far as winter riding goes, depends on whether you're talking
> commuting, or trail riding. I think I'd have no problems trail riding in
> most conditions in the winter (think it'd be pretty fun, actually,
> though I haven't tried it, yet).
>
> But, I don't care to bike commute to work in snowy, slushy conditions. I
> tried it once, to see what it was like, and felt scared for my life the
> whole time I was riding in traffic. I have about a 14-mile one-way
> commute, with about 7 of it in moderately heavy city traffic. My front
> tire kept wanting to go the path of the car tire tracks, especially when
> I hit the cross streets. I felt that my tire could have twisted, and I
> could have slipped down at any given time. And, riding in the city,
> slipping could have meant slipping under a car, truck, bus or semi. That
> would NOT have been fun! So, I decided, that day, that I'll only bike
> commute in the winter if the roads are clear, and I'm relatively certain
> they'll still be clear on the way home.
>
> Now, I know a number of people here in Milwaukee who ride all year long,
> no matter what the conditions are. They have no problems riding in snow,
> slush, or ice. Just throw a set of studded tires on, and away you go!
> They find it fun! They're more hardcore than me. I'm just not made for
> it, I guess.
>
> Just another case of 'to each his/her own'.
>
> I hope you do try winter riding, whether for commuting purposes, or just
> for fun. You may find that you like it more than summer riding!!! And, I
> personally think you get more respect from not only other bicyclists,
> but some cagers, too!!! Well, and some cagers will just think you're
> psycho, but, don't worry about them. ;-)
>
> Good luck, and have fun!!!
>
> --
> Eric Babula
> Milwaukee, Wisconsin, USA
>
> Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention
> of arriving safely in a pretty and well-preserved body.
> But rather, it’s to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up,
> totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming, 'Wow! What a ride!!!'
>

[email protected] wrote:
> ~R wrote:
>
>>How cold does it have to be for one to consider themselves a
>>hardcore rider? I rode to work in 39 degree F weather yesterday
>>and this thought popped into my head. It was pleasant, but it's
>>getting colder every day.
>>
>>Looking at http://www.icebike.com makes the whole winter-riding
>>concept look very apealing!
>>
>>~Rob
>
>
> Well I have stopped at -59 C (with windchill) because the bike was
> freezing up (freewheel pawl was taking about 30 seconds to fall). Good
> thing too. I was not really prepared for it and probably would have
> gotten frostbite on the ride to work.
>
> Much below -25 C and I find it is getting cold. OTOH I wonder just how
> hot it can get before stopping riding. I don't think I've ever cycled
> in anything over about +43 C. Either extreme is something to worry
> about.
>
> Around here I think that between about +4 & -4C (your 39F is in there
> somewhere) can be the most uncomfortable riding weather. It is
> diffucult to dress for and there is a problem of getting wet.
>
That's a good point. Freezing rain SUCKS. A crisp but clear and sunny
day of 5F (-15C?) can be enjoyable. The most hardcore commuters are
those blinking their way through hail storms in late fall.

Beyond that you just have pesky mechanical problems like freezing cables.

"Collin O'Neill" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> [email protected] wrote:
). Freezing rain SUCKS. A crisp but clear and sunny
> day of 5F (-15C?) can be enjoyable. The most hardcore commuters are those
> blinking their way through hail storms in late fall.
>
> Beyond that you just have pesky mechanical problems like freezing cables.


A partial solution is to have a one speed bike for days when freezing rain
is a threat. At least it stays in gear. With multi-speed bikes, the gears
ice up and the chain skips over them, and you have to stop to clean off the
ice. It's the pits.

"Ron Wallenfang" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

> ...My most embarrassing day was warmer - a 35 F wind driven rain in early
> April that I wan't prepared for with adequate clothing - I had to pull
> into a fast food place after 7 miles of riding and call and ask my wife to
> come get me - I couldn't stay warm enough!

Just above freezing, windy and rainy are just about the worst bicycling
conditions. Much, much colder than riding in a snowstorm below freezing.
It's also harder to find adequate clothing for such conditions.

> I had studded snow tires but found them insufficiently helpful to keep.
> They help on ice but not otherwise, at the price of being very slow and
> very noisy.

All true (although they help in snow relative to slicks), but I find they
give me confidence in conditions where it is dark and there may be black ice
due to a daytime thaw and evening freeze. Otherwise, I tend not to bike in
those conditions.

"~R" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> How cold does it have to be for one to consider themselves a
> hardcore rider?

If your core has started to harden it's a sign you should have dressed more
warmly. Keeping your core warm is vital.

The question is like asking what you have to do to be a "real cyclist".

"Ron Wallenfang" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

> I'm another Milwaukee area bike commuter, who hasn't been stopped
> by the cold since I've been keeping daily records in 1993. Coldest
> riding day in that period was -15F. There have been a couple of
> colder days here over those years, but I rode in the "heat" of the
> afternoon those days. Snow and ice have, from time to time, forced
> me not to commute, though I've always gotten in at least some
> riding in the course of the day/evening. The plows and salt trucks
> are ubiquitous and do a good job here (at least on the arterials),
> so you're rarely completely shut down for long. The most difficult
> day was the Jan 2, 1999 blizzard, when I waited for the snowplow
> to come by on our street, and then rode up and down that street a
> bunch of times for 5 miles of riding. Close behind it was a week
> in Madison before Christmas a few years ago that featured an
> unusual combination of snow and bitter cold. One evening that
> week, I went to a tavern where my sister's blue grass band was
> playing (She didn't know I was in town). Her first reaction on
> seeking an abominable snowman type character come in was to ask
> herself: "Who's that idiot out biking tonight. Then came the
> realization: "That's my brother!" My most embarrassing day was
> warmer - a 35 F wind driven rain in early April that I wan't
> prepared for with adequate clothing - I had to pull into a fast
> food place after 7 miles of riding and call and ask my wife to come
> get me - I couldn't stay warm enough!
>
> I had studded snow tires but found them insufficiently helpful to
> keep. They help on ice but not otherwise, at the price of being
> very slow and very noisy. My zero mileage days since 1998 are
> limited to 23 days off in 2003, when I was hit by a car and
> separated a shoulder, 26 days off this past summer, while
> recovering from surgery, and one day lost in 2004 due to travel.
>
>
>

Now, I'd consider THAT hardcore! Nice job, Rob!

Did you bike every day the year that we had 50" of snow in just the
month of December? What was that year - 2000?

Ok, I admit it - I'm a wimp! My ~14-mile commute takes me about an hour,
on a normal day. In the winter, it takes even longer. The one day I rode
in the snow, it took 1hr45min, and I was not having fun. Bicycling is
supposed to be fun.

I too often let the weather be my excuse for not riding my bike to work.
I gotta work on that.

Do I hear a New Year's Resolution, already?

--
Eric Babula
Milwaukee, Wisconsin, USA

Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention
of arriving safely in a pretty and well-preserved body.
But rather, it’s to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up,
totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming, 'Wow! What a ride!!!'

Eric Babula wrote:
> "Ron Wallenfang" <[email protected]> wrote in
> news:[email protected]:
>
>
>>I'm another Milwaukee area bike commuter, who hasn't been stopped
>>by the cold since I've been keeping daily records in 1993. Coldest
>>riding day in that period was -15F. There have been a couple of
>>colder days here over those years, but I rode in the "heat" of the
>>afternoon those days. Snow and ice have, from time to time, forced
>>me not to commute, though I've always gotten in at least some
>>riding in the course of the day/evening. The plows and salt trucks
>>are ubiquitous and do a good job here (at least on the arterials),
>>so you're rarely completely shut down for long. The most difficult
>>day was the Jan 2, 1999 blizzard, when I waited for the snowplow
>>to come by on our street, and then rode up and down that street a
>>bunch of times for 5 miles of riding. Close behind it was a week
>>in Madison before Christmas a few years ago that featured an
>>unusual combination of snow and bitter cold. One evening that
>>week, I went to a tavern where my sister's blue grass band was
>>playing (She didn't know I was in town). Her first reaction on
>>seeking an abominable snowman type character come in was to ask
>>herself: "Who's that idiot out biking tonight. Then came the
>>realization: "That's my brother!" My most embarrassing day was
>>warmer - a 35 F wind driven rain in early April that I wan't
>>prepared for with adequate clothing - I had to pull into a fast
>>food place after 7 miles of riding and call and ask my wife to come
>>get me - I couldn't stay warm enough!
>>
>>I had studded snow tires but found them insufficiently helpful to
>>keep. They help on ice but not otherwise, at the price of being
>>very slow and very noisy. My zero mileage days since 1998 are
>>limited to 23 days off in 2003, when I was hit by a car and
>>separated a shoulder, 26 days off this past summer, while
>>recovering from surgery, and one day lost in 2004 due to travel.
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> Now, I'd consider THAT hardcore! Nice job, Rob!
>
> Did you bike every day the year that we had 50" of snow in just the
> month of December? What was that year - 2000?

Yes, that was 2000. What a great month for snow -- it piled up
to our carport roof! I think I rode most of those days (I'm in
Madison) -- but my commute during winter is a short 1.4 miles. I'll
usually only forgo biking if it's snowing and the streets weren't
cleared from the last snow before the snow started, which means
there are likely frozen ruts to deal with. No Thank You.

If I can't bike, I walk, and walking during a snowstorm has to be
one of *the* best things in the world!

Scott

Scott <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

> Eric Babula wrote:
>> "Ron Wallenfang" <[email protected]> wrote in
>> news:[email protected]:
>>
>>
>>>I'm another Milwaukee area bike commuter, who hasn't been stopped
>>>by the cold since I've been keeping daily records in 1993.
>>>Coldest riding day in that period was -15F. There have been a
>>>couple of colder days here over those years, but I rode in the
>>>"heat" of the afternoon those days. Snow and ice have, from time
>>>to time, forced me not to commute, though I've always gotten in at
>>>least some riding in the course of the day/evening. The plows and
>>>salt trucks are ubiquitous and do a good job here (at least on the
>>>arterials), so you're rarely completely shut down for long. The
>>>most difficult day was the Jan 2, 1999 blizzard, when I waited for
>>>the snowplow to come by on our street, and then rode up and down
>>>that street a bunch of times for 5 miles of riding. Close behind
>>>it was a week in Madison before Christmas a few years ago that
>>>featured an unusual combination of snow and bitter cold. One
>>>evening that week, I went to a tavern where my sister's blue grass
>>>band was playing (She didn't know I was in town). Her first
>>>reaction on seeking an abominable snowman type character come in
>>>was to ask herself: "Who's that idiot out biking tonight. Then
>>>came the realization: "That's my brother!" My most embarrassing
>>>day was warmer - a 35 F wind driven rain in early April that I
>>>wan't prepared for with adequate clothing - I had to pull into
>>>a fast food place after 7 miles of riding and call and ask my wife
>>>to come get me - I couldn't stay warm enough!
>>>
>>>I had studded snow tires but found them insufficiently helpful to
>>>keep. They help on ice but not otherwise, at the price of being
>>>very slow and very noisy. My zero mileage days since 1998 are
>>>limited to 23 days off in 2003, when I was hit by a car and
>>>separated a shoulder, 26 days off this past summer, while
>>>recovering from surgery, and one day lost in 2004 due to travel.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> Now, I'd consider THAT hardcore! Nice job, Rob!
>>
>> Did you bike every day the year that we had 50" of snow in just
>> the month of December? What was that year - 2000?
>
> Yes, that was 2000. What a great month for snow -- it piled up
> to our carport roof! I think I rode most of those days (I'm in
> Madison) -- but my commute during winter is a short 1.4 miles.
> I'll usually only forgo biking if it's snowing and the streets
> weren't cleared from the last snow before the snow started, which
> means there are likely frozen ruts to deal with. No Thank You.
>
> If I can't bike, I walk, and walking during a snowstorm has to be
> one of *the* best things in the world!
>
> Scott

You're lucky you're so close to work. Let's see: 14 miles divided by
3mph = way too long to walk.

Since I'm too chicken to ride my bike to work in snowy/slushy/icy
conditions, I'm stuck with the car, unfortunately.

--
Eric Babula
Milwaukee, Wisconsin, USA

Mike Kruger <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> "Ron Wallenfang" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>> ...My most embarrassing day was warmer - a 35 F wind driven rain in early
>> April that I wan't prepared for with adequate clothing - I had to pull
>> into a fast food place after 7 miles of riding and call and ask my wife to
>> come get me - I couldn't stay warm enough!
>
> Just above freezing, windy and rainy are just about the worst bicycling
> conditions. Much, much colder than riding in a snowstorm below freezing.
> It's also harder to find adequate clothing for such conditions.

Welcome to Seattle. Here's your rain jacket, fenders, booties, tights,
wool socks, and full finger winter gloves. Did I mention the sixteen
hours of darkness in December/January?

--
Dane Buson - z u v e m b i @ u n i x b i g o t s . o r g
"He's dead, Jim. You grab his wallet,
I'll grab his tricorder."

"Dane Buson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Mike Kruger <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> Just above freezing, windy and rainy are just about the worst bicycling
>> conditions. Much, much colder than riding in a snowstorm below freezing.
>> It's also harder to find adequate clothing for such conditions.
>
> Welcome to Seattle. Here's your rain jacket, fenders, booties, tights,
> wool socks, and full finger winter gloves. Did I mention the sixteen
> hours of darkness in December/January?
>
At Unseen.edu can't you just wave your wizard's wand and have it disappear?
http://www.unseenuniversity.demon.co.uk/

In article <[email protected]>,
Eric Babula <[email protected]> wrote:

> Ok, I admit it - I'm a wimp! My ~14-mile commute takes me about an hour,
> on a normal day. In the winter, it takes even longer. The one day I rode
> in the snow, it took 1hr45min, and I was not having fun. Bicycling is
> supposed to be fun.

a couple of years ago, after an evening shift -- 12 miles/2.5 hours.
<http://tinyurl.com/cnkse> Last winter i had a 7 mile (i moved)/2+ hour
ride home one night. Cops thought i was crazy. tiring as the dickens,
but always fun...

Sometimes the sekrit is self deception and bald-faced lying. "I AM
HAVING FUN!!" "I bet all those stupid people in their stupid Tahoes
wish they were me!" "i didn't want dinner anyway" It's like when i
tell my niece that learning multiplaction tables are fun...

Seriously: it is possible to renormalize fun to include sufficiently
small values so as to allow one to enjoy 2 and 3 hour slogs through 18
inch snowfalls. Crazy, but possible.

But i hear you, nonetheless. It's not like hopping on and heading out
for fun in July.

..max